Reds striker Andy Carroll rejected a move to West Ham United last week, and with only three weeks of the transfer window remaining, it seems increasingly likely that the 35m will remain at Anfield for the next few months at least. Liverpool manager Brendan Rodgers is not pulling any punches over Carroll's first team chances, and in an interview today, he reiterated once again that Carroll could be facing an extended time on the bench.
Speaking to Reporters earlier, Rodgers confirmed again that he is working on bringing new players to the club, and when asked about Carroll's position, he said:
"Between now and the end of the window there are going to be players feeling a little bit unsure and insecure. There is a new manager and more players to come in, but Andy has been terrific.
“He [Carroll] knows exactly where he stands. He is like everyone else. He has to fight for his position. There are not many clubs you could go to and be a guaranteed starter.
"I understand Andy wants to play games, but he really enjoys it here. I have had a number of conversations with him and we will see how that develops".
Last week, World Cup winner Frank Labeouf delivered the following assessment of Carroll, which I agree with 100%:
"I don't know why they signed him in the first place! He doesn't match Liverpool's way of football, and I don't think he fits the culture of Liverpool. I love the way Swansea played: keep it on the floor; small passes and possession football, and Andy Carroll is incapable of doing that, and that's why he [Rodgers] doesn't want to keep him. Liverpool should sell Carroll, not loan him.
I recently conducted a survey on the site asking if fans would like to see Carroll leave:
* Approx 7500 people voted.
* 54% of of participants votes YES to Carroll leaving Anfield.
Not a huge majority, but it's a majority nonetheless.
Jaimie Kanwar
Speaking to Reporters earlier, Rodgers confirmed again that he is working on bringing new players to the club, and when asked about Carroll's position, he said:
"Between now and the end of the window there are going to be players feeling a little bit unsure and insecure. There is a new manager and more players to come in, but Andy has been terrific.
“He [Carroll] knows exactly where he stands. He is like everyone else. He has to fight for his position. There are not many clubs you could go to and be a guaranteed starter.
"I understand Andy wants to play games, but he really enjoys it here. I have had a number of conversations with him and we will see how that develops".
Last week, World Cup winner Frank Labeouf delivered the following assessment of Carroll, which I agree with 100%:
"I don't know why they signed him in the first place! He doesn't match Liverpool's way of football, and I don't think he fits the culture of Liverpool. I love the way Swansea played: keep it on the floor; small passes and possession football, and Andy Carroll is incapable of doing that, and that's why he [Rodgers] doesn't want to keep him. Liverpool should sell Carroll, not loan him.
I recently conducted a survey on the site asking if fans would like to see Carroll leave:
* Approx 7500 people voted.
* 54% of of participants votes YES to Carroll leaving Anfield.
Not a huge majority, but it's a majority nonetheless.
Jaimie Kanwar
What exactly is Liverpool's "way of football"?
ReplyDeleteThat is explained within Labeouf's quote.
ReplyDeleteWhy are people so convinced that Carroll can not play brendans style of football? he's proffesional footballer? i'm sure he will pick it up quickly enough? Carroll wasnt outstanding last season but towards the end he started to find some form. he's a top player who unlike a few others loves the club and wants to play for the team! on top of all this the guy is still very young so better times are surely to come for him. Liverpool cant always rely on pass and move etc. what about corners or Free kicks etc? he's the guy most likely to grab a goal in those situations. I hope he stays unless we get some sort ov money back near what he cost! Brendan is clearly stating that no ones position is safe which is correct players should have to fight for positions instead ov just being a big name and assuming they will be starting every week.
ReplyDeleteBit gutted about bellers situation i think he would have fitted in nicely in Brendans plans!
I think Carroll is a fantastic Player but like it has been stated he does not suit the liverpool way and think he was a massive panic buy when we lost torres.
ReplyDeleteEveryone wants to see there team play great pass and move football and unfortunatly Andy does not fit in to that style and it is a shame as he has fantastic ability and it is sad to see a player of his quality struggle.
Being realistic we need to sell with out making to much off a hole in the bank balance and because off his poor run of form that is not going to happen.
Maybe a loan would be best for all parties, offloads his wages for a season saving us around 3.6 mil for the year also gives the player a change to regain his form and make the clubs around take notice so we can see at a higher price than we are getting offered at the minute.
We need to bring in a quality striker who will be able to run past defenders I.E Sturridge, Defoe But without seeling carrol this does not seem possible as we need to seel to raise funds so it seems to be a sticky situation for all parties involved.
Brendan Rodgers seems to be turning the screw; finally a manager at LFC who seems to have that personable personality to get players onside and at the same time make them feel 'insecure' about their position in the team.
ReplyDeleteI'm certainly not being literal but, he really has learnt alot from a certain Mr Mourinho who deals in a very similar fashion with those in his charge.
This is good because complacent players are lazy, slow, self-entitled big heads who feel it a right rather than a hard fought privelige to be chosen to play for LFC.
It's about time our manager made them feel unsettled until they prove themselves worthy and even then, they should be kept on their toes.
As for Carroll, twitter et al has gone nuts in rebellion at the suggestion of disposing of £35 million on the cheap; I do so hope our hierarchy are not wilting under the pressure of the populous, instead, BR should do what HE feels is right even if it isn't 'popular'.
After all the the more confident he feels with his team per we and his team selection the more that will rub off on the players.
I'll understand if he keeps him, as tiki-taka takes time and we need results this term, but I'll also understand wholly if he sacks him, as change needs to happen and the quicker it does the quicker we all get used to it, a faster more mobile more intelligent stricker.
Sink or swim.
JK some players have a certain style of play and are unable to addapt and obviously BR has seen enough in training to see that carroll cannot adapt to the type of player he wants in his squad and feels by selling he would be able to improve the team.
ReplyDeleteThe worrying thing is that not just Caroll staying. Another season with him and SD,JH,ChA and JS as well. There r days when I can't wait for the new season to start and than I c these players mentioned above and I'm not optimist at all. Let's hope that BR brings few players in b4 the window shuts otherwise I'm not expecting much from the new season.
ReplyDeleteBecause Brendan's style is quick sharp passing and not from HOOFING it up the pitch for knock ons or swinging in crosses.
ReplyDeleteThe team will NOT be built around one player and it requires the players to have TECHNICAL ABILITY.
The qualities make it highly unlikely that Carroll will fit into that style of player.
He's not quick of mind or feet and he cannot beat a player with his speed or ability.
The only thing he offers is an aerial threat
that good
ReplyDeleteWhy are people not convinced?
ReplyDelete* 57% passing accuracy last season
* 30% shooting accuracy
* 5.2% conversion rate
* Only 64% of Aerial duels won.
A player with 57% passing accuracy is not going to fit into team that is built on accurate passing! It doesn't matter what way you look at it, Carroll is not good enough. He's 23 - if he hasn't got the basics of technique down by now, he's never going to improve.
Caroll will be loving Liverpools bench admiring the the oak veneer and the craftsmanship given he had West Ham out to stitch him up. On the bright side even the best get benched: Torres at Chelsea played second fiddle to Drogs for a while and will be under pressure if Hulk or another top striker signs Neymar even sturridge will give Torres enough to think about. So Caroll should not be disheartened whatsoever. The lad has talent if any one decent comes in just play your socks off however little or much action you see. In time Caroll can establish himself no doubt.
ReplyDeleteSwansea managed to play possession football in the Premier League last season with Danny Graham playing up front. Andy Carroll is more than capable of playing in Rogers' team.
ReplyDeleteI'd be happy if he made the following so insecure they'd move on:
ReplyDeleteDowning :No threat, no guile, no assists, no goals
Adam :Slow, dirty in a tackle,no guile
Spearing :The only reason he's still there is because he's a local no guile,poor passing very average
Carroll: Just wont fit with the new style of play
Carragher: Unsettles EVERY CENTERBACK HE PLAYS WITH, slow, no goals, no assists
Brendan talks a good game but believe me as much as like many other's want you to succeed.
However he will be judged much more quickly if you put out the same players from last season, than if he tries the new ones or younger players.
people shud give big andy a chance,, he's young enuff to learn to play with the ball at his feet.. look at crouchie,,,he became excellent at it during his time in red... also andy is great at defending the oppos corners.i hope he does well,, and besides with maxi kuyt possibly bellers and agger going or gone,, maybe andy is cover for agger,, he would make a great centre half,lol YNWA JFT96
ReplyDeleteGot to agree with JK here. While I would love Andy to work out, I just can`t see that he will, and would prefer a quick answer to this, sell him if we can get 20mil for him and buy a top class replacement who will fit what we need more.
ReplyDeleteIt is not just the fact he doesn`t fit us, its also that I felt last season he was a burden to the club, not his own fault but every interview was Andy this or Andy that, it puts pressure on him and the team and takes focus away from whats needed.
I think Rogers noticed this and that is the main reason he wants him to go.
put it this way, Kenny had no option to back him, or it would take away confidence, yet by doing so it makes fans question his judgement and other players lower there standard.
ReplyDeleteMaybe he is not suited to Brendan Rodgers play, but who knows. Maybe he can adapt and change. Also he is a different player. I think that can be positive if/when we are faced with a defense we cannot unlock. Then a impact sub like Carroll, "a diffrent player", could just do the trick. At least at this stage it is way to soon to write Any off and later come to regret it.
ReplyDeleteWith respect, the Danny Graham comparison is a myth. Graham's passing accuracy was far superior to Carroll; his shooting accuracy was 50%, and he had the PL's 5th best conversion rate for strikers. Plus, he scored 12 league goals, which was 8 better than Carroll.
ReplyDeletei am sure all the players are nervious about there appearance money next year the pressure they are under now rodgers as or his getting rid of the dead wood kuyt maxi,agger skertal carrol bellamy and bringing in all these star players.sorry forgot there names?it must have adams spearing and the rest quaking in there boots fsg have played a blinder if it all goes wrong sack him at least it will cost f"£k all in transfers and they will have made a tidy few quid happy days indeed for some
ReplyDeleteHe should keep carrol since he want 2 commit him self and prove is worth . Just get a very good striker 2 play up front 4 us . Any news about ramirez .
ReplyDeleteAC's touch and control can be wayward BUT Rodgers had a big striker at swansea also, and that worked out. This sounds like posturing.
ReplyDeleteFSG are aware that they got turned over by newcastle, and in general during KD's lavish spend , and are keen to ensure the same thing doesn't happen again.
The remit would have been, get the best out of these players or sell them for the best price possible, but don't be desperate to sell or else fatty ashley will have our pants down again.
AC could end up hanging around as a plan B, should the right offer not come in. Now AC has realised that he would not be first choice at Newcastle, he's said he wants to stay.
We could better use the money elsewhere, although we dont want to get rogered again. My money is on him staying, the toon don't really need him, and there appear few other options for the drunken cave man Carroll.
You forget to mention:
ReplyDeletelucas: overrated footballer with 1 goal and 5 assists during his last 5 seasons in the premier league, i.e he averages
1 goal for every 5 season and
1 asssit per season
No wonder we struggle to score with such limited players in our midfield
Glen Johnson: a liability as a left back.
Henderson: effeminate player shying away from every challenge
Gerrard: Old and past his best. The fact is that we win more matches when he does not play.
Looks like you have been shot down there G O by the JK lol
ReplyDeleteFair enough Brendan Has obviously seen more of him in training etc but didnt Rodgers say a few week ago that Andy can fit into his style of play? and that it's unfair that people are saying he cant? i suppose going of them stats though it looks as if hes just protecting him. Well if he isnt going to fit in fair enough but the big guy is still a threat in set piece situations. Just annoying how much Liverpool stand to lose on the guy though! maybe it would be better all round to loan him then and if that works out Liverpool could end up getting a bit closer to the 35 mill they payed!
ReplyDeleteif bellers and carroll go though surely another striker has to be brought in? agree with Panda as well Sturridge would be a nice buy.
Whatever people say about Carroll he can still be dangerous awkward player! just hope where ever he goes he doesnt come back to haunt us
He explains the way Swansea played not Liverpool's "way of football". I'm interested to know what your perception of the Liverpool way is?
ReplyDeletePass and move football, obviously. Not 'hoof it to the big man', which has been creeping it's way into the club ever since Houllier signed Emile Heskey and Erik Meijer.
ReplyDeletepass and move... Dominate possession, intricate inter-plays, psychic like team work, genius strikers (Dalglish, Keagan, Rush, Fowler), never giving up!!! (so called "fans" take note - CL 05, almost into administration just 3 years back, FA Cup 06), STEVEN GERRARD!!! JC, style, flair, music! (Anfield Rap, YNWA, Anfield Road, The Beatles), Sons of Shankly, European Nights, passionate and educated supporters (not you internet lot though) - The complete and outright rejection of Roy Hodgeson, but when he came back to Anfield, supporters warmly greeted him ... I refer mostly to the golden years, but that my friends is the Liverpool way!
ReplyDeleteI could back no other!
BR for the future
ynwa
Nonsense... Carroll has massive potential to hold the ball up, nod balls in from deep crosses by winger strikers, can defend, works hard, can bulldose opposition and he's got a wee bit of trickery...
ReplyDeleteHe's got the nuts and bolts, its all about tightening up, and who better than BR to help him do that. He got tremendous support from KD... I still believe in KD and his decisions in the signings he made (bar Adam). So its about support for a Liverpool player, chosen by arguably the greatest player ever for the club who also happened to be one of the best managers ever for the club.
Get in there Carroll, chosen to do your duty by the king... you're good enough for me!
Ynwa!
You can't simply rely on stats. Swansea as you say play a passing game to feet. Included in your damming stats for AC will be hopeless balls pumped up to him from 40 yards. It's simply unfair to compare the two. However given the choice how many EPL managers would choose Graham over Carroll. I'm confident not many so what does that say about the stats.
ReplyDeletethis is such a rubbish headline ... 'you will feel insecure'. when did rogers say that about carroll? yet again we get rubbish bloggers making things up (because if you read on, the comments are positive, whereas the headline suggests otherwise). sensationalism at its ugliest. zero integrity to proper reporting.
ReplyDeletePathetic both the above comments.
ReplyDeleteSo there hasn't really been a "Liverpool way" since prior to Heskey signing 12 years ago? John Aldridge wasnt a pass and move forward but we played some of the best football I have seen us play when he was playing up front.
ReplyDeleteHow many games did he start last season... He had injury issues.
ReplyDeleteIt must have been tough for him to leave his home town where he
was worshiped by the fans, coming to a club with the stature and
history of Liverpool (injured). The pressures
are light years from that of New
Castle. Our fans weren't backing him... when he went
back to NC to play there, he was boo'ed by the fans who used to love him.
who Isn't going to be affected by that mentally JK? You always
leave out the fact that he did well toward the end of last season, and probably
the reason England were knocked out the euros is because "Bollocks"
(my name for Roy Hodgson) didn't start him in that last game (played well in
the euros too). A player described as "unplayable" at times.
The fact is, Andy has offered and I hope will continue to offer something
different to Liverpool, I can see improvement in his game... he may not have
pace or the ability to beat players, but he has an eye for an assist, he has
strength and I love his flick ons (although I must admit I dislike his passes
straight back), he also has a cannon of a left foot and a decent eye for goal -
all he needs is a run out and some goals!
I'm still of the opinion he just needs some work and he needs to continue to
work hard. The box is dangerous on set pieces... Skrtel, Carroll, Throw Gerrard
in there and that's some serious firepower. He's young, remember that too. How
sure of yourself were you at 23?
I back Kenny's choices of signings!! (except for Adam and his bs hollywood passes)
I hope you weren't referring to me as an "internet" fan? My point is its been a long time since we played the Liverpool way but some people seem to think it was the beginning of the end when we bought Carroll which is ridiculous.
ReplyDeletenice 1 kev!
ReplyDeleteI think Rogers words were more along the lines of this
ReplyDelete"you would expect any player who cost 35mil to fit into any style of play".
Which could be a double edged statement, one almost showing his alarm at how much we paid, and the second and more importantly in my view, is that its a statement to any buyers out there.
Who would pay a lot for a player who`s own manager thinks hes one dimensional? Got to keep other managers thinking he can fit into there team too if Rogers is to get the full 20mil for him
You can't say that about Lucas , your bang right but you can't say it . I like yourself cannot understand the press the fella gets . I think your description of him " limited " is flattering to him . Fed up of reading about how much we missed him last season , got to two cup finals without him .
ReplyDeleteAye Toshack was a nippy little ball player with a deft touch and lightening pace ,
ReplyDeleteTo be fair, I am not sure that long-ball is the only way Carroll can play. I am not saying he is the best option up front, but I think since he is at the club he should be utilised (and man-managed) appropriately.
ReplyDeleteI was disappointed that you included his price in the article, because I think it sometimes distracts from reasonable debate about Carroll's appropriateness in the new set-up. But in fairness you did not use his price as part of your argument. I guess its just my own sense that discussions about Carroll happen in a shadow that is not always fair on the player.
Carroll isn't the most mobile player, but I think he could play fairly effectively as the false false-nine: i.e. holding up and laying off to Suarez and Borini (or Downing in a new role as wide forward??).
Again, not saying its going to win the league, or even make top four. But it showed signs of working last season, and may turn into a useful system.
I guess my biggest concern about getting rid of Carroll is the lack of realistic or ready alternatives, and given we don't have £25 mil (another 'fairly good' player for under £25 mil wont really add much) I would say lets work hard and smart with what we have and build a team that at the very least loses less away and wins more at home. That would be a good start ...
I hope it works out for Carroll. Maybe this threatening talk from Rodgers is exactly what he needs.
ReplyDeleteAnd lets be honest we cant rely on stats can we. Look at Downings stats before he came to Liverpool, decent on paper, but in reality not so good, but again I hope he turns it around too. 1 goal in 1 competitve appearance is a good start I guess, albeit against a 'weaker' team.
nobody heard of coaching? why dosent liverpool bring in a coach to teach players to play THE LIVERPOOL WAY not just caroll but all players that BR dosent rate you never know it could get the potential they brought them to show through we might even uncover a few gems we have struggled in front of goal since rafa left so an attacking coach could really benefit team just a thought
ReplyDeleteWhat's the big fuss about BR's statement. Isn't it like that in every football club?! Competition starts from within and players can adopt to new tactics and formations. What if during a game BR needs a CF to keep the ball up?! I assume that sometimes the players tire and can't keep passing the ball for the entire 90 mins. I'd rather have him here than loan him to newcastle and then sell him for less than half of the price. Newcastle will definetely try to sell him again when he is in good form! Why can't no one see the bigger picture!
ReplyDeleteJamie, a quick question: where do you get these stats from? Not that I disagree with them. Its just that it would make it easier to formulate a response if I could also look at a list of stats, and comparative players and years. Are these something that is available to your knowledge, withough some subscription fee?
ReplyDeleteI was working on an hypothesis that might show that Carroll's stats are in line with generally below-expected stats across the team last season. In which case, one could potentially argue that something structural was not working in the team. Certainly, a bunch of players with great stats from the previous season (Downing, Henderson, Adam, and even Suarez) had much lower stats last season. Either theit true quality showed when they arrived at Liverpool (for some I would agree), or there are other factors at play.
ReplyDeleteI know it doesn't mitigate Carroll's below-par performances, but I just wanted to situate the stats in some way.
Stats are mostly from OPTA, which unfortunately a subscription service. You can find somenopta stata online for free though; the LFC website, for example
ReplyDeleteSent from Samsung Galaxy Note
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Subject: [liverpoolkop] Re: 'He will feel insecure' - Rodgers warns LFC flop to expect first-team 'fight'... | Liverpool-Kop.com
Stats are not a fair an accurate comparison in terms of goals.. Graham started 34 games and played approx 800 mins more football than AC which should be taken into consideration and presented when comparing goals scored.
ReplyDeleteThe passing percentages were 64%v77% and while superior it's intresting to note that Luis Suarez's passing accuracy was LOWER THAN ANY OTHER SWANSEA PLAYER last season(excluding Vorm).
If the biggest stick being used to beat Andy is his poor passing then can we assume by virtue of Suarez's poor accuracy that he won't fit into BR's style of play either ???
Your using stats to try to beat the guy out of the club, and unfairly so..
How bout the stat that AC created more chances per minute than any player who was under Rodgers at Swansea last season ???
Which is more important..? A series of accurate 5 yard sideways passes to bolster your stats or actually creating chances for the team.. I think any right minded person would say the latter.
I understand views on players are subjective but stats objective and should be presented so.
You want Caroll out.. fair enough.. Personally I want to see him work under BR for a year and see how it goes.. I just wish you would give the guy a break and present all the stats and facts and not just the negative ones which suit your opinion he should exit stage right.
I think stats can be very helpful, but I agree with the general sentiment. We bought a bunch of players with decent stats two seasons ago (Henderson, Downing, Adam etc) and none of them really did well at LFC. Carroll appears the biggest let-down, primarily because of price I would argue, but probably also because he didn't score nearly enough to justify being our primary striker.
ReplyDeleteHaving said that, I don't agree that Carroll's game is one-dimensional. Sure, he is not a great passer of the ball, which suggests he wont fit into Rodgers plans (I am a fan of Rodgers, by the way, I think he is a great choice). But I also think that Rodgers needs to adjust his style of play, partly because a manager must also work with what is available (i.e. Carroll), but primarily because Swansea were not very potent up-front. I would argue that we need a combination of Swansea's ticka-tacka (jeez, I hate that word so much), and the slightly more counter-attacking pass-and-move style that all too infrequently worked beautifully under KD.
We didn't get lots of goals last year, and a change is needed. But neither did Swansea. Sure, the mitigating factor is they were Swansea, a small team punching above their weight. We were Liverpool, a big club on the decline, and you might expect us to have outscored the Swansea's of the EPL. But this may also account for the poorer passing stats (not only for Carroll, but the team in general). Swansea played rather deep, and held the ball. Liverpool in general had an attacking formation and style, though with little bite I agree. Though I would not argue this totally, I do think that Carroll's stats are influenced by the way he was played, and there were a few times where we saw glimpses of great through balls and lay-offs (before you crucify me, i am not saying glimpses suggest a great player). Its just that I could see Carroll working fairly effectively as the hold-up guy, pushing defences deep and opening space in the hole for Suarez and Borini. Maybe not the ticky-tacky, Swanselona, 80% possession some expect from Rodgers, but we actually can't afford a situation where each new manager changes the entire team to suite their style each time they arrive. Building a team takes at least a few seasons, and working with what is available, adjusting to what exists, and having a long-term outlook. I think its for this reason that stats alone make me feel a bit uneasy. Players' games develop and are molded into a system: c.f. Lucas. Obsessing with stats alone may lead to a situation like the Indian Premier League cricket, where each season managers compete to buy a new eleven players based on performance stats last year. These are not teams, but franchises.
As long as Carrolll is happy to warm the bench along with Carragher, Adam,Spearing and Downing I hve no problem with them.
ReplyDeleteJust keep them away from the premier league games, FA Cup, Europa League let them have a run out in the League Cup
We all know who the poor players are so I want to know why are they even insecure they know they're not good enough
ReplyDeleteSorry to ask if we should not compare players on the basis of stats, then how do you suggest for making comparisons between players? DG scored 12 goals for Swansea whereas AC scored 4 for LFC is here to stay. Or shall we talk about price tag? Impact when the players are on the pitch? Influence? If DG is playing for LFC and AC is playing for Swansea, I'm quite sure the player chosen for England is going to be DG instead of AC. I can really see many blind faith in AC but I really cannot understand the rationale behind it. He is a professional soccer player who is on 80 grand a week and scored 4 league goals for LFC in the entire season. I think every loyal fan of LFC has the right to demand performance from him, don't you think so?
ReplyDeleteCaroll hadn't even joined up with the first team when BR was trying to offload him, so he had seen nothing in training.
ReplyDeleteI think you will find that the stats you are showing are a fair bit lower than those published by opta. I notice you choose not to mention his 2010/11 stats when with Newcastle. This article gives a more objective view.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.anfieldindex.com/4614/opta-stat-attack-andy-carrolls-time-liverpool-fc.html
Why are your stats lower than those published by opta?
ReplyDeleteJamie can you please comparison on Carroll's, Heskey's, Babel's and Ngog's Stats. I ask this because skill and ability wise I feel all players are far better than Carroll. It's just funny that we seem to make all the excuses in the world for Carroll but other players are just thrown under the Bus I wonder why!!!
ReplyDeleteThey're not lower. 57%= Carroll's oassinf accuracy in the opposition half. Obviously, that is the stat that matters the most.
ReplyDeleteSent from Samsung Galaxy Note
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Subject: [liverpoolkop] Re: 'He will feel insecure' - Rodgers warns LFC flop to expect first-team 'fight'... | Liverpool-Kop.com
One would expect the Brittish transfer record signing to be under pressure to perform at whatever club , whoever it is.
ReplyDeleteAt the moment its AC .. Of course the press are going to be 'Andy this and Andy that', especially given the fact he was not being given a fair share of game time and under performing. I think alot of the line of questioning about Caroll was directly and in directly aimed at KD .. Why had he payed £35m on a player and not playing him ? Had KD made a mistake in signing Caroll? Certainly the price he paid anyway.
I think the opposite to you.. with so much hoop la about AC , the press went lightly on huge money signings like henderson and Downing.. If anything he took pressure off them.. not that you'd know it by the way they both performed.
Perhaps it is, but do you not think you could be a bit more objective when using stats on Caroll, Jamie?
ReplyDeleteWhat do you mean 'objective'? The stats are the stats, and I'm not going to gloss over them and put a positive spin on them just because some LFC fans can't handle reality. Carroll is.not good enough for LFC, and that's been shown time and time again. The club is more.important than the individual, and LFC will not progress on the field at the requisite speed wjth Carroll upfront.
ReplyDeleteSent from Samsung Galaxy Note
-------- Original message --------
Subject: [liverpoolkop] Re: 'He will feel insecure' - Rodgers warns LFC flop to expect first-team 'fight'... | Liverpool-Kop.com
I'm not having a go but this proves my point that stats are being presented in a subjective manner.. if you mean 57% in the opposition half then please state that in the intrest of clarity and fairness.. not in a way that pertains to show it as his over all figure.
ReplyDeleteWith regards to passing accuracy mattering most in the opposition half.. Isn't it fair to say that a stray pass in your own half can be as detremntal to a team as an accurate pass in opposition half can be benifical to a team ???
you are a son a female dog jaimie kianwas
ReplyDeletePrior to Liverpool signing him; 11 goals and 3 assists in 18 starts sounds more impressive. A goal every 1.6 games. That's being objective.
ReplyDeleteNo, that is not being objective - that is making excuses. Who cares what Carroll did two years ago? How does that have any bearing on his end product and impact on the team last season?
ReplyDeleteSteven Gerrard scored 23 goals in 2005-6; should we use that as a benchmark for his current effectiveness too?
Carroll was the focal point at Newcastle; the whole team was set-up to serve him. That's not how it is at LFC, and that's not how it should be, either.
a lot of interesting banter going back and fourth about Andy's future. I actually hold Brendan Rodgers partly responsible for some of the confusion regarding Carroll's future. He came into Liverpool and even without actually meeting Carroll made a statement claiming that he was open to selling him. He later has made anothe another statement stating that he was not claiming that Carroll was going out on loan and that you don't just get rid of a 35million pound player because of rumors that he can't fit into the coaches system. So i think that Rodgers has back pedalled a lot when it comes to Carroll lately.
ReplyDeleteHe is clearly not a favorite on Rodger's list but with the limited striker options i don't think he has any choice but to keep him on-board till more signings can be made.
If I may be brutally honest Liverpool's performance will not really improve that much next season since it is mainly the same under performing squad from last season that we still have. The only new face has been Fabio Borini. A lot of rumors about possible signings but not a whole lot of technically sound players brought in yet. The big question i have is can Liverpool actually play like Barca? The answer is no i don't really think so. We can adopt certain key tactics from them but we will still be embarrassed on the pitch if we played them. The technical gap between the two teams is like night and day. I happened to see Liverpool play in their North American tour in a place called Baltimore and while the game was entertaining both teams were not really serious about winning the game . Tiki Taka didn't look all that good. I feel that our current squad will need to be revitalized with more technical signings before we even begin to see an improvement of our on field performance. So the additions of players like Joe Allen, Clint Dempsey, and Sahin from Madrid would definately do a enough to raise the level of play.
Getting back to Andy Carroll and the rest of the squad. I believe our basic squad can become more technical and really adopt the new strategy that BR wants employ but it is just not going to happen next season and we should prepare for a mid-table finish. After watching the game in Baltimore, I realized that we do not have enough creative playmakers on the team . Alonzo has never been replaced and no one has the responsibility to make set the pace for the offense on a permanent basis.
So the quick fix is more technical creative types signed , and allow two seasons to see a dramatic improvement on the pitch.
Carroll can be actually thought BR's new strategy just like the rest of the squad but is believed that he would have a harder time adopting the new strategy than the rest of the club.
Don't expect drastic improvement to the clubs performance until we make at least 4 or 5 real signings.
It shows what he is capable of! Simple as that.
ReplyDeleteIts silly to use a 7 year old stat, surely you can admit that? Gerrard no longer has the legs he had in 2006. The carroll stat I used is a recent one for a young player who is yet to fulfil his potential.
The Carroll stat is arguably irrelevant as the team in which he played was set-up to serve him. If Liverpool played hoofball continuously, and the game-plan was to get long balls/crosses into the box all the time, then I'm sure Carroll would score more goals. However, that's not what LFC is about, and nor should it be.
ReplyDeleteI`m assuming you are a fan of lucas...Truth hurts doesn`t it? You may be in love with lucas like many other fans out there but the fact is that we did not really miss him when he got injured. Before his injury we were among the 3 best teams in terms of goals conceded together with man city and newcastle. By the end of the season nothing changed as we were still among the 3 best defensively with man city and man utd this time. Stats dont lie... People may think we missed him when he did not play and that his absence was the reason we performed so badly in the league but thats not true. Our good record defense-wise was only due to the fantastic work of our pair of center backs agger and skrtel, lucas had NOTHING to do with it. Whether he plays or not it makes no difference, we are still as solid in defence.
ReplyDeleteI am pleased he might stay. He is an asset and a great plan B. Liverpool have had big target men in the past. I remember well Toshack playing for Shanks, we have had Robinson, Paul Stewart and then the likes of Heskey (I wont include Meijer as he only played 24 times scoring twice) Peter Crouch and I am sure there are others ( Roger Hunt, Bobby Graham).
ReplyDeleteRodgers has got rid of the right players in Kuyt, Maxi, shame about Bellemy hoped he would stay.
Maybe Rodgers should now concentrate on bringing in some quality to enhance or improve the squad. Buy if the player is better but not to replace like with like
"effeminate player" ???
ReplyDeleteDid you watch US v Canada women's Olympics semi final?
Evidently not, the tackling and commitment was as hard as you would get anywhere.
FINALLY A LFC FAN THAT CAN C THAT IT'S PLAYERS SUCH AS LUCAS HAVE had more of a negative impact on lfc than ac pls I think this should be debated more, we have no midfielder sg is fading... Then who, Lucas lol
ReplyDeleteWe sure missed his negative impact last season didn't we? I agree SG is in the twilight of his career,so I think with a midfield of Lucas,Shelvey and Allen if we get him we will have a decent midfield .As for AC I say move him on,he is not pacey or technically gifted enough and will continue to struggle,just don't think he is going to fit into the scheme of thing's,only problem is that he is not worth anymore than about 10mil
ReplyDeleteAgain, its quite amusing that it was only last season that fans were screaming for Carroll's head to roll and now people seems to be arguing for his stay.
ReplyDeleteAlthough, I would like Carroll's stay to work out but if the chances of his success at LFC is less than 60%, then we should let him go. No point holding on to someone and HOPE that he will somehow succeed. Brendan as the manager should know better who he thinks will have a high chance of succeeding in the squad under his playing system.
By the way, as far as I can recall, the Liverpool way has always been the pass and move way.
Football is a team game, 11 players working together for a result. I didnt miss many games last season. The service AC received from our woeful midfield was appalling. Downing, Henderson, Adams etc were all poor, the balls AC received were wayward (to be kind) and given in the wrong areas. AC worked his nuts off as an individual but ALL STRIKERS need service to be totally effective. Ask Drogba or Torres. take Torres when he played for LFC the service he received from Gerrard and Alonso and Lucus was superb. When at Chelsea no service and looked a much lesser player. I say based on the last 3 months of last season and the euros, give the lad another season. Thats my rationale behind my support for AC
ReplyDeleteThis is how this site works. Take everything with a pinch of salt :)
ReplyDeleteI think this is very damning from BR, today on the LFC website
ReplyDelete"Then I look at the potential of the front four in terms of Borini, Suarez, Gerrard and Downing and you've got pace, power, creativity and hunger, so I'm excited about going forward.
Agree 100% my friend that truly is the Liverpool way support the whole team and the manager good post my friend. ynwa
ReplyDeleteLet me get this right Andy dosent suit Brendans style so therefore he has to be sold. Stats are being used to back this up. Other stats are being used to show that Andy could be of use to the team ie number of goals scored at Newcastle. These stats dont matter cause we dont play to Andys strengths. So heres my prob when I played football it was the team that put the ball in the net the most times within the 90mins that won. So we have a player that can score goals if his strengths are played to but were going to sell him instead of using him when all else has failed. Another point when Andy played he wasnt just a threat going forward he was also one of the reasons we didnt consed as many goals from set pieces so he is of benefit at both ends of the pitch and i for one think the big lad should be given a chance along with everyone else.
ReplyDeleteBy watching them play. That's how you judge a player
ReplyDeletemore tosh
ReplyDeleteThanks
ReplyDeleteNot finally . Been saying it forever , well prob. give him benefit of doubt at first . One and only time I ever phoned TV / RADIO , had argument with Brian Reade and Jan Molby about him , after saying my piece , both of them said he's a good squad player , but he isn't . He adds nothing . And to the people who compare him to Didi or Macsherano , well shame on you , not even close to Momo and actually think Igor would be a bit miffed to be compared to him , anchor man ? Prob. right dragging us down , not for too much longer tho aye ? You can kid some o the people some o the time , but you can't kid all o the people all o the time . Adam , Spearing , Henderson , Shelvey , Allen , Binns all better than him . Honestly do not think hold down a place at say Leeds , Huddersfield , Binns ? He's our postman , that's a joke by the way, as is our " back four protector " " midfield enforcer "
ReplyDelete" our DM " , and for any of you people who disagree , well your wrong . Oh yeah RB put him in the side regularly , at around the same time as he was trying to replace Alonso with Barry , so wasn't thinking that straight at the time aye ? Kenny played him till he got injured , why ? Was Kenny thinking straight last year ?
" we'll keep doing what we're doing and see where it takes us " , oh and Woy played him and look what happened to him , and regular for Brazil , well actually that one has got me F***ed , although it is the worst Brazil team in living memory .
Withiut a hint of irony, JK uses 54% as a victory and proof that 'most LFC fans want AC out. Then goes on to use a higher percentage, 57%, as a reason to bash AC. Really glad you arnt in any kind of employment with LFC Jamie or we would really be f*cked. I can imagine how you were telling everybody how rubbish a 23/24 year old ivorian recently signed from marsaille was for Chelsea and how if he hadn't got it by now he never would. Go on tell me how wrong i am and how Drogba was always going to be different and other such rubbish that you spout.
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