After an exceedingly poor first 18 months at Anfield, it looks increasingly likely that Andy Carroll will be sent out on loan next season. Such a move would arguably be good for both Carroll and the club, but former Chelsea star Frank Labeouf believes that Liverpool should cut their losses and dump Carroll permanently now.
Discussing Carroll's situation on ESPN a few days ago, Labeouf - who won the World Cup and the European Championship with France - praised Liverpool manager Brendan Rodgers as a 'perfect match for the Liverpool culture', and then delivering a withering assessment of Carroll. He scathed:
"I don't know why they signed him in the first place! He doesn't match Liverpool's way of football, and I don't think he fits the culture of Liverpool.
"I love the way Swansea played: keep it on the floor; small passes and possession football, and Andy Carroll is incapable of doing that, and that's why he [Rodgers] doesn't want to keep him. Liverpool should sell Carroll, not loan him.
West Ham Boss Sam Allardyce is definitely interested in signing Carroll. He told Sky Sports this afternoon:
"You can't say you wouldn't be interested in Andy Carroll, he's a player who has got great stature in the Premier League. Whether Andy Carroll wants to come to West Ham is another matter"
A move to West Ham seems unlikely, and QPR midfielder Joey Barton believes that Carroll should return home to Newcastle United::
"I feel it would be a good move for Andy. He knows the area, he is a Geordie boy. He made it quite clear all along that he never wanted to leave the club – and though he might not have been exactly pushed out the door, the money was obviously just too good for Newcastle to turn down.
I agree with Labeouf, and maintain the same view I've had for the last nine months: Carroll should be sold asap, even if it means taking a big loss. The reality is that whatever happens, the club is going to lose money on Carroll, so what difference does it make if it's now or later?
It was a catastrophic mistake to sign him. Take it on the chin and move forward.
Jaimie Kanwar
Discussing Carroll's situation on ESPN a few days ago, Labeouf - who won the World Cup and the European Championship with France - praised Liverpool manager Brendan Rodgers as a 'perfect match for the Liverpool culture', and then delivering a withering assessment of Carroll. He scathed:
"I don't know why they signed him in the first place! He doesn't match Liverpool's way of football, and I don't think he fits the culture of Liverpool.
"I love the way Swansea played: keep it on the floor; small passes and possession football, and Andy Carroll is incapable of doing that, and that's why he [Rodgers] doesn't want to keep him. Liverpool should sell Carroll, not loan him.
West Ham Boss Sam Allardyce is definitely interested in signing Carroll. He told Sky Sports this afternoon:
"You can't say you wouldn't be interested in Andy Carroll, he's a player who has got great stature in the Premier League. Whether Andy Carroll wants to come to West Ham is another matter"
A move to West Ham seems unlikely, and QPR midfielder Joey Barton believes that Carroll should return home to Newcastle United::
"I feel it would be a good move for Andy. He knows the area, he is a Geordie boy. He made it quite clear all along that he never wanted to leave the club – and though he might not have been exactly pushed out the door, the money was obviously just too good for Newcastle to turn down.
I agree with Labeouf, and maintain the same view I've had for the last nine months: Carroll should be sold asap, even if it means taking a big loss. The reality is that whatever happens, the club is going to lose money on Carroll, so what difference does it make if it's now or later?
It was a catastrophic mistake to sign him. Take it on the chin and move forward.
Jaimie Kanwar
I think a loan deal for Andy will benefit both LFC and Andy he will see what it's like at another club ( other than NUFC) and LFC will still have a plan "B" SHOULD things go astray with their new passing movement, also he can't score against us if we play his new team, as he won't be playing for them
ReplyDeleteWe could do with the £20m from his sale, to bring in one or two more technically gifted players who would suit Rodgers' style better.
ReplyDeleteIts a shame for the lad, but lets face it, he only put a shift in towards the end of the season when he wanted to be picked for the Euros and with the transfer market reopening.
If we do get £20m for him, it would basically mean we made £35m profit from the sale of Torres, which is still pretty good business considering the form he'd been in for some time prior to his sale.
Sell him. Was really excited when we signed him though and he didn't do to badly for the second half of the season keeping in mind injuries..but last season proved he is not reliable. And the style of football we're playing won't suit him. Sell him to the highest bidder.
ReplyDeleteIMO he is not worth even £15M in my eyes. Will be interesting who will be willing to pay a huge fee for him and also match his £70,000 pw wages.
I think there is an unfair view of Andy Carroll as some kind of oversized caveman incapable of playing the game on the floor. Not true Just because he hasn't shone for Liverpool yet doesn't mean hes no good. Going by the last year and a half Pepe and Gerrard aren't great players.
ReplyDeleteHe deserves a chance under the new regime to prove his worth. People always talk of what a player owes the club but never what the club owes the player.
I do think he is not in the mold of what rogers wants but to be fair liverpool need a whole draft of world class players if they want to play like barcelona. I just hope tika taka is not short lived as we can now see even barca with a world class team get beaten in the league and lose to a chelsea side who adopted a ultra defensive couter attack against this type of football. If teams do this against liverpool next year we can pass it around the park all day long but the likes of stoke, wigan and the rest will let us have 70% possesion and high completed pass rates as they know all they have to do is go ultra defensive and try the odd couter attack and play for a draw or a 1 nil win. Carroll although has not fired while at liverpool and to be fair nor did surez or any other player score bucket loads last year but what he does do is give you another dimention in the event tika taka just comes up against a rigid physical wall of defenders. I am up for keeping him, as we found to our mis fortune having a large person on the bench can do you good, only if benitez give crouch more time in 2007!!!!!
ReplyDelete'What difference does it make if it's now or later' ?
ReplyDeleteWell if thats the case why not give him at least a season under BR to see if he can improve and utilise the clubs most expensive asset ?
Your obviously in favour of moving AC on, and fair enough but can you try to be a little bit more balanced in your coverage of the story.
Every article you write on the matter (the ones I've seen anyway and I'm open to correction) are always anti - Andy. You seem to trawl the football world in search of ANYBODY ( Joey Barton, REALLY!? ) who shares your view on the matter.. and it's obvious your own personal opinion is driving this totally one sided coverage of the story.
There are plenty of people in the football world who think, like myself, that AC should stay at LFC for at least another season.
Does all this negative talk about a current LFC player serve any purpose, besides a self serving one that is ?
Jaimie you got the wrong Barton, it was ex Newcastle defender Warren Barton who said that about Carroll.
ReplyDeleteRodgers, like Wenger and Barca, do not often resort to plan B. Rodgers often stuck to it, even if when some would say in some games it clearly wasn't working last season.
ReplyDeleteFor me, if your not a plan A player, than don't bother coming up with a plan B, as you need to offer up both, especially for the money. Maybe if he cost peanuts, just maybe, I'd be more receptive to a player that doesn't really fit into plan A but offers plan B. I generally do not subscribe to this 'plan b' argument to salvage Carroll's Liverpool career. I'd take the money we can get for him.
Why have you written this JK Brendon Rogers has stated clearly that Andy Carroll will not go on loan. Why have you started your article with it looks increasiingly likely. Bredon Rodgers has said there is a possibility he will be sold out right (mistake imo) but not loaned
ReplyDeleteWe have very little to base Carroll on as he is in his early 20s, whereas Gerrard and Pepe have been around for a while. At the end of the day, Carroll's best form to date came at Newcastle when they were playing a direct aggressive game with him and (when fit) Ameobi up front. He hasn't come anywhere near that form here. So I think some people are justified and fair in their thinking, that so far, Carroll hasn't shown much to illustrate that he is more than some battering ram, even if he is only in his early 20s.
ReplyDeleteWerner spoke to Sky recently on the Carroll thing:
ReplyDelete"The only thing I can say is we will do what's best for the club."At the moment, Andy is on the squad. He was an important member of the English team, he has got a lot of talent and we will see what happens there."Brendan is clearly the leader here, and hopefully the question will be answered shortly."But at the moment, Andy is on the team and we are looking forward to his contributions."
Big word, 'incapable'. Harsh on Andy Carroll, that.
ReplyDeleteAs i said last Nov on a few sites, Andy Carrol was not bought by Kenny, maybe Comolli or the board of directors. Torres departed last min, left us with 50mil near the end of the transfer deadline. If we didn`t spend that money the tax man would have took 50%. So 35mil for Carrol was 17.5mil paid by LFC 17.5mil inland revenue. Sell Carrol for 20mil. We made 2.5mil profit and 15mil loss offset to next year accounts. Good business, Bad buy as a player. Kenny`s taken alot of the blame for the transfer. Carrol is not a LFC player and never will be.
ReplyDeleteThe point im trying to make is that none of the players have covered themselves in glory over the last year.
ReplyDeleteTbh Id rather keep Carroll an extra year and lose 5m more on his resale knowing full sure he is no use to us than sell him now and risk him hitting the form of his life. That could be just as damaging to the clubs image.
dlfc don't want to loan him.they want straight cash which means they want rid.rodgers has a style of philosophy,he isn't going to be interested in 'plan b' and i doubt carroll will be happy to be 'plan b' and get ten mins where he has to chase long balls.
ReplyDeletewell said.
ReplyDeletethis 'plan b' nonsense is basically scraping the barrell and people trying to convince themselves he's good enough.
'at the moment andy is on the squad'
ReplyDeletehardly a ringing endorsement or hands off warning to other clubs.
Rather dramatic that the notion of a player doing better after leaving the club will somehow damage the club. He is just one player. If you were talking about Gerrard a few years ago, just maybe you might have a point but this is bloody Andy Carroll, a player who has done bugger all to justify having a lot of faith in him. He could well go on to do good at a mid-table team but I simply do not see him as a player for a club aspiring to be at least in the top 4. At this moment in time, very little to set him apart from Heskey and Duncan Ferguson.
ReplyDeleteYep, none of the players covered themselves in glory last season was one of the points you made but some of them have proven to be quality time and time again in the past, like the two you mentioned, whereas Carroll has only proven to be good in a top tier league for a mere six months in a side that was playing direct football. Yet somehow we should be putting trust in him. Not much difference between him and Heskey in relation to their development by the time Ivanhoe left us, and that isn't a compliment (Leicester-Newcastle, British hype on the pair, both came for club record transfer fees and both were/have been underwhelming to say the least for this club. Worrying pattern). He has done very little in his career to date, so I think some people are justified and fair in being negative about him.
i don't think that Carroll's improved form after the club sells him outright to another club would be damaging to the Liverpool's image. He has already damaged the clubs image enough last season. I personally would like him to be a third striker for us . Some one to come in for either Borini or Suarez whom ever is playing up front.
ReplyDeleteI have recently felt sorry for Andy Carroll so I am no longer such a strong advocate of selling him outright. I am not going to say that Andy won't be able to learn to play the way Rodgers wants to play. I just don't feel I want Andy Carroll to be the first choice striker for Liverpool. If he can be loaned out that is also okay too so he can get exposure to other types of football with out the media scrutiny of Anfield. If Andy stays at Liverpool or goes on loan next season should be a massive learning season for him where he becomes a sponge soaking up info. We certainly need somebody with a better strike rate and more technical touch on the ball starting for us on a regular basis.That person won't be Carroll next season. If he is luck might be him the next season after next ofcourse it all depends on how he impresses Brendan Rodgers during training .
He's not a plan B player, he's plan A because he can play on the deck, but more because, free kicks, corners etc are such a big part of the game, both for and against, Andy can be the most effective player in the league at these times and they happen in every a game, wether your playing plan A,B,C or Z
ReplyDeleteThis is the perfect time to sell Andy.
ReplyDeleteHad we let him go last January, we surely would have received less than we will now.
His goal against Sweden showcased his talent perfectly and luckily there's still a lot of managers in the game who value his attributes.
£20 million is too optimistic, although still a fantastic bit of business for Newcastle. They earn £15 million for giving Andy an 18 month sabbatical. Not bad.
The problem is of course that his value drops from here, as warming the bench is not a good advert.
So you think Dalglish lied to everyone when he said Carroll was his choice?
ReplyDeletePffft. His 'play on the deck' ability was hardly apparent in KK's attacking style, I shudder to think how worse he would look in the possible Rodgers style. But hold on, it is more because of his set piece ability, he should be in the side?....bloody hell.
ReplyDeleteAs KK said on more than one occasion, KK was part of the transfer policy and rightly so, he takes plenty of blame. In relation to your bits about the tax bit, anything official to back that up from say FSG, etc? Or is it just speculation?
ReplyDeleteIncapable is a very unfair verdict of Andy Carroll. He has his talents. The question is will he fit in with Brendan's style. Loaning should not be an option. If Brendan can't fit him in, he should be sold. Don't want another Aquilani dilemma.
ReplyDeleteId be for selling him if were going to buy international class players with the proceeds but its going to be the likes of dempsey or allen then we might as well stick with what we have.
ReplyDeleteLast year, Sunderland earned £6 million for loaning out Gyan for a year. Why can't Liverpool ask for a big sum for a year's loan. Liverpool's negotiators should fired! They never could out with a good deal after any negotiations.
ReplyDeleteRodgers style, is not that different from KK's style, both have elements of pass and move, how it all pans out remains to be seen. But as for Andy and his ability, he did look out of place early on, problems seemed more positional and effort in the earlier part of the season, he didn't seem to know what his role was?? but his control, his ability to hold on to, then release the ball improved dramatically as the season wore on, I don't really know what his psychology is like, he may have struggled under the burden on that ridiculous fee, maybe he just struggled to settle,but what I do know is towards the end of the season he started to look every bit the player we thought we'd bought. As for touch on the ground, look at the last 5-6 games he played, he has plenty of ability, also if you've ever played against a 'big' man you will know, his shear size, long leavers etc make him very difficult to play against. We will probably be playing against teams, retreating into their own 1/3rd of the pitch, the one thing they wouldn't want us to have is a man mountain, causing mayhem in the box. I'd rather have him on our side than playing against us any day of the week.
ReplyDeleteRodgers' style is very different from Kenny's and I think that is reflected in training. Instead of 5 on 5 games, Rodgers' favours imbalanced numbers. Kenny's style was based on freedom and fluidity which made use of players' natural abilities. Our players played by instinct and the new players were given more time on the pitch to develope the necessary understanding.
ReplyDeleteBrendan, on the other hand, is a control freak in the mold of Rafa. He has a very clear idea of what exactly he wants his players to be doing and you can see that in the way he has divided up the pitch. Where Kenny was a big fan of unpredictability, Rodgers actually has a rigid system to impose, based on the zones the players operate in.
Another Carroll bashing thread.......... Who is next Pepe? Johnson? Borini?
ReplyDeleteFor me, Carroll was shit for most of the season and near the end, he was average. Because he was so shit, (in my view) any decent improvement coupled with fans' nature to justify at all costs the club's decision to spend big on a player, has got some people getting all precious and sensationalistic about Carroll's so-called great improvement. Amazing how people get carried away with a few decent games and how they conjure up such faith, based on it. He barely looked like the player that put in a good six month form at Newcastle in PL. By the way you are going on about him, you would think he is Drogba. But in my book, he is far closer to Heskey and Duncan Ferguson, than Drogba. Carroll's touch, pass-n-move movement, etc, is mediocre at best. His movement in the box? He is quite time in the box, so sluggish in the box. His big man ability alone is not worthy of a first XI side that aspires to be at least in the top 4. Not many big sides are obsessed with having bloody 'man mountains' up front, unless he has some real technical ability like Drogba or Ibra, which Carroll really doesn't have, nowhere near. Its not the be all and end all, not like how your making it out to be and to me, it sounds rather archaic the way you place importance on it and typical in this country at times, a la Big Sam. I think Carroll is a highly overrated, typical of British hype, and is a waste of money. You'd rather him in our side, I'd rather we didn't.
ReplyDeleteCarroll bashing? Nonsense. A World Cup winning player said something about Carroll, and to me that's newsworthy. Neither he nor I personally attacked Carroll. Football is a game of opinions; you have yours, I have mine.
ReplyDeleteDrogba at Carroll's age wasn't half the player, he became at about 28,as for Carroll a comparison to Drogba isn't as ridiculous as you obviously feel, there is nothing in the way we are proposing to play that says Carroll couldn't be a valuable part,
ReplyDeleteIt all comes down to how Rodgers views him, we don't have Messi, Iniesta, and co, so the way we will play won't be identical to Barca, if we try it without the right players it could be a disaster for the club. Even Barca, with the 'right' players for the system had problems in breaking down well organised teams, (not just Chelsea, they also had problems with AC Milan) I feel that Carroll adds a dimension, you obviously don't, we will only know who is right if Carroll stays.
That's an interesting take on it, the entire system is supposed to have come out of the Ajax team of the 70's, a team that already influenced LFC and how most of us feel football should be played, Kenny played in the most mobile of the British teams, basing everything on good, pass and move, if as you say Rodgers is more disciplined in how he applies these philosophies it will be interesting to see how, our own free spirit, Steve Gerrard adapts to what to a player of his type most feel very restrictive
ReplyDeleteDrogba was quality from 25 at least. before 28, including his time at Marseille. Yep, he got even better later but that aside, he
ReplyDeletewas a feared striker in his mid-20s. To say he was half the striker before 28 is just sensationalistic waffle, in my view. Maybe 24 or before, fair enough.
Carroll has barely done any good in his career to date. A mere six month of good form at Newcastle in PL and few decent games at Liverpool, yet somehow he is akin to Drogba in his quality. He has done bugger all. Not sure how anyone can be so optimistic about him, like you have, as he has done bugger all to deserve it.
To date, Carroll's development mirrors Heskey's. Both played for mid-table clubs at the time, Leicester and Newcastle. Both got hyped up by the media & co as the next big British thing. Both got signed for club record fees by Liverpool. Both showed nothing beyond the archaic big man ability they have/had. Both have been/were underwhelming to say the least in a Liverpool shirt. Worrying pattern.
'there is nothing in the way.......', yes there in my view quite a few things that say he wouldn't, Carroll has the pass-and-movement of a elephant and the technical ability of Bebe, so that suggests to me he won't be that valuable to the main style.
Carroll does add a different dimension, I never said he didn't but that different archaic dimension alone isn't enough, he has to fit into the plan A, which to say the least I am doubtful of. No use adding something different, if you can't fit into the existing function of the team.Barca don't care for a plan B especially one of Carroll's type, if you can't fit into a plan A and that was Ibra's downfall. Considering their success in recent times, I think they are justified in being stubborn in their thinking like that. Most big sides don't care that much about having some archaic big man mountain. And I agree, its a little too archaic, a one-dimensional big striker like Carroll or Kevin Davies (Yes, I feel there isn't much difference between what Carroll offers and what Davies offers). Its rather out of date and Big Sam-like.We will know whether he truly fits in when he shows it on the pitch. But I'd rather he just leave. Certainly not a player I want for this club to rely on, if they want to be at least a top 4 club and play good football.
I'll leave it there, before ends up getting more repetitive. Cheerio.
£500
ReplyDeletehello
ReplyDeleteBob, I think they've already had a go at Jonhson and Pepe so Borini better hit the ground running or they're keyboards might melt.
ReplyDeleteIf Borini starts making demands in public and trying to force a payrise then I will also highlight it. The chances of that happening are zero though, so it's not an issue.
ReplyDeletedidn't you know we spent 35mil on him because he can defend set plays?
ReplyDeleteTormentor, are you mixing web pages, this link is about the merits or otherwise of Andy Carroll, as according to F Labeouf, not as your reply seems to indicate Skirtel?
ReplyDelete