With Liverpool light in the striking department, Fabio Borini's loan move to Sunderland last night is (arguably) tantamount to a vote of no-confidence in the Italian striker, but Reds boss Brendan Rodgers maintains that he still has 'real belief' in Borini, and he's now explained why he allowed the striker to move.
In an interview with the official Liverpool FC website today, Rodgers confirmed that Borini had slipped behind Sturridge, Suarez and Aspas in the pecking order, but insisted that he'll be following his progress closely:
"It's just to get games. He had a stop-start season last year with his injuries and I just felt this year he needed to go and play football.
"We had a host of clubs wanting to take him, but [at Sunderland], I'm sure he'll get the chance to shine and we'll look closely at his development this year.
"I have a real belief in Fabio - he is a talent and we've seen that on occasions, but he needs to be playing regularly to demonstrate that talent"
I personally think Borini's LFC career is over, and I can't see him returning next summer, even if he does well. If Borini doesn't fit into Rodgers' system now, what difference is a year away going to make? The Italian is not a wide player, but the manager insists on playing him there, which is a major reason for his failure in the team.
It's the Andy Carroll situation all over again:
* LFC manager spends big bucks on a striker who obviously won't fit into the system.
* Manager sends striker on loan to 'get games' etc.
* Striker leaves a year later after being replaced at his parent club (Carroll/Sturridge)
Privately, Rodgers will probably be hoping that Borini has a great year at Sunderland so that Liverpool can recoup the bulk of his €13m transfer fee.
Overall, Rodgers has done superbly well in the transfer market, but the Borini signing has proven to be a massive mistake, and a giant waste of money. The same could also be said of Joe Allen - £15m spent, but the Welsh midfielder is now a bench player for Liverpool.
Allen may come good this season, and he's certainly more equipped for success in Rodgers' system than Borini, but for now, the harsh truth is this: Liverpool have received absolutely ZERO palpable benefit from that combined £26m outlay.
As for Borini - I predict he'll return to Serie A next summer.
Jaimie Kanwar
NOTE: Please stick to the Comment Policy (Click to read)
In an interview with the official Liverpool FC website today, Rodgers confirmed that Borini had slipped behind Sturridge, Suarez and Aspas in the pecking order, but insisted that he'll be following his progress closely:
"It's just to get games. He had a stop-start season last year with his injuries and I just felt this year he needed to go and play football.
"We had a host of clubs wanting to take him, but [at Sunderland], I'm sure he'll get the chance to shine and we'll look closely at his development this year.
"I have a real belief in Fabio - he is a talent and we've seen that on occasions, but he needs to be playing regularly to demonstrate that talent"
I personally think Borini's LFC career is over, and I can't see him returning next summer, even if he does well. If Borini doesn't fit into Rodgers' system now, what difference is a year away going to make? The Italian is not a wide player, but the manager insists on playing him there, which is a major reason for his failure in the team.
It's the Andy Carroll situation all over again:
* LFC manager spends big bucks on a striker who obviously won't fit into the system.
* Manager sends striker on loan to 'get games' etc.
* Striker leaves a year later after being replaced at his parent club (Carroll/Sturridge)
Privately, Rodgers will probably be hoping that Borini has a great year at Sunderland so that Liverpool can recoup the bulk of his €13m transfer fee.
Overall, Rodgers has done superbly well in the transfer market, but the Borini signing has proven to be a massive mistake, and a giant waste of money. The same could also be said of Joe Allen - £15m spent, but the Welsh midfielder is now a bench player for Liverpool.
Allen may come good this season, and he's certainly more equipped for success in Rodgers' system than Borini, but for now, the harsh truth is this: Liverpool have received absolutely ZERO palpable benefit from that combined £26m outlay.
As for Borini - I predict he'll return to Serie A next summer.
Jaimie Kanwar
NOTE: Please stick to the Comment Policy (Click to read)
If he can help out Di Canio, then the Black Cats may even sign him for an inflated fee!
ReplyDeleteI think he will play well enough at Sunderland to be brought back into the fold. I find his style of play fits well with LFC because of his off the balll movement- his willingness to make runs. He is technically gifted, just seems to lack a bit of composure in front of goal. I think that will come with games and goals at Sunderland- if he settles there.
ReplyDeleteWe don't know what will happen to Suarez, but I think many of us would be surprised if he stays beyond this year. That would leave us only with Sturridge and Aspas as recognised forwards and I don't think Aspas is strong enough to lead the line.
On another note, I could see Jordan Ibe coming good as a striker.
Even if Borini does well, where will he play if he returns to LFC? He won't play as a central striker whilst Sturridge and Suarez are fit, and if Suarez leaves, LFC will replace him with another top class striker.
ReplyDeleteif rodgers had any confidence in borrini he would have given him more time preseason ,when he stopped even getting on the pitch you knew is time was up,
ReplyDeleteIf he plays well surely he'd then be used as back up to Sturridge and Suarez? The problem was he wasn't playing well for several reasons, breaking his foot and then dislocating his shoulder didn't help for a start, not just playing on the right. Difficult to see it's "no confidence" when BR is clearly saying the lad has talent and is expressing faith in him but he needs game time. If he had no confidence surely he'd have just sold him?
ReplyDeleteWhat is your take on having 5 Centre Backs (Agger, Toure, Skrtel, Sakho, Illori) in a season we are not in Europe, and hence few games? Should Illori go to a championship club to gain experience?
ReplyDeleteThis is true, but the question was not where or when he would play, rather if he would play again for LFC. and I believe that with Sturridge's injury record and the likelihood of Suarez leaving after a year, Borini will be taken back into the fold to be used as and when required.
ReplyDeleteFurthermore, as he can in theory play across the front line, he would serve as cover for 3 positions.
If Borini does well at Sunderland then great, if not there is no question we take a hit and move on. Joe Allen could still be important for us. He's clearly not everyone's favourite yet, but without him in the side this season we are stuggling to retain possesion in the second half of games.
ReplyDeleteI've also been wondering about this - it's 5 plus Kelly. A few people rightly said last night that our transfer business will finish in January ie our centre backs aren't cup tied so could be of interest to clubs still in the Champions League, and we might might be able to pick up a decent forward player or two from those who are knocked out. Also, if you look at our december fixture particularly chelsea and city away on the 26th and 28th we're going to need to rotate players
ReplyDeleteI think it's fine. The cup competitions will provide extra games; injuries will inevitably occur; Ilori is only 20, so it's not a problem if he doesn't play that many games. Despite his performance v Man U, Skrtel is down the pecking order. In reality, it will probably be Agger/Toure and Sakho fighting for the 2 first-team CB slots, with Skrtel and Ilori as back-up.
ReplyDeleteAdditionally, Rodgers will almost certainly rest Agger a lot more now that there's so much cover.
If he does well, i'd have him back as back-up but the question is will he want to play second fiddle to Sturridge and Suarez? because he will struggle even if he is playing well to take their places in the team.
ReplyDeleteThis is the big question we are all asking. Personally i think he should stay the first season to settle and allow us to have a look at him in U21s.
ReplyDeleteI also think Skrtel could be tried out as DM at least as cover for Lucas or in Cups. He has the speed, tenancity and energy for it and his passing is really quite good for a CD as well as his on the ball composure. I like the idea of him hounding down forwards and midfielders in front of 2 solid CB.
Off topic. How about bringing back Mohamed Sissoko on a free? He would be great signing imo. Extra competition in midfield and great cover for Lucas if he gets injured ( touch wood he doesn't get injured ).
ReplyDeleteBORINI isn't LFC standard.I said it for most of last season.I looked at his good movement early on and thought we had something to work with.But very quickly i realised he doesn't have that extra something you need to be top striker at our club.
ReplyDeleteHe could help SUNDERLAND but I don't think it'll be enough to keep DI CANIO as manager.He will be gone within 10 games.The reason is obvious losing the players respect.The constant over the top public criticism is the rantings of a hothead.It's not done in the typical reverse psychology way.His post match interviews are very entertaining but it must drive their players crazy.
SUNDERLAND letting SESSEGNON go to WEST BROM for 6m shocked me.I thought he was one of the best 3 players they had.Only a falling out with DI CANIO explains that for me.
Agree mate, I was very surprised we didn't get someone in to replace him. I suppose Aspas can play as a central striker if needed but i'm worried we bought him to chase the ball down rather than to score goals. Personally i feel sorry for him, he is working his socks off but isn't getting the reward for it because he is playing out of position imo.
ReplyDeleteMARTIN SKRTEL will go to a club in Ukraine or Russia because their transfer window closes in a month!
ReplyDeleteBorini was a comfort signing from Rodgers, and Allen too. Of course, most of us did not mind Allen coming in for £15M BR really got it wrong. He was worth £7M at best.
ReplyDeleteI agree that we have received zero output from them. Allen still has potential but I don't know his form dipped so much?
As for Borini, he is a striker. Not a wide player. Furthermore I don't think he is the type to score 20 goals a season. I hope he does well for Sunderland.
They will soon find out that signing so many players at once will backfire.
I am content with our transfer window. The Moses loan is interesting but I wish there was a buy clause at the end of the season. At least it gives us a guarantee. Sakho will be a best and I have a feeling Ilori might play as a DMC a few times.
However a word of caution, Liverpool won't maintain this form. They will dip eventually and get some bad results. But I believe we will be battling fiercly for that top 4 spot. The Arsenal and Totte matches will be imperative for our chances.
PS let's hope we don't get any injuries on the internationals.
It's kind of like lukaku. At Chelsea he doesn't have a chance but at west brom he shines. He goes back to Chelsea and he can't play regular and he doesn't seem good again. Same for Sturridge when he was in Chelsea and city. Some players need to play regular and in the right position to realise their potential. Not everyone have the ability to fight for places like Henderson. Also he got a serious injury which prevent him from going all out. So lets hope he can do well and regain his form.
ReplyDeletewasn't Allen's dip in form at least partly accounted for by his bad shoulder injury? Being left out for a bit doesn't always do players any harm. It seemed to strengthen the characters of Lucas and henderson
ReplyDeleteAh! Well if we get decent money for him, then great. I thought he was excellent against United, but Rodgers mind was made up a long time ago about him.
ReplyDeleteJase, i can remember when you wasn't a big fan of Rodgers.Are you warming to him yet?
ReplyDeleteWhat are your opinions regarding FSG? I'll be honest, i'm still not a big fan. Don't get me wrong, i'm glad the defence got sorted but feel Rodgers got let down on the main attacking target he wanted.
Look at how many players have to leave the club just so new one's can come in.
no. one cissoko is more than enough
ReplyDeleteDont agree with anything in this article. Hes going out on loan to get game time as at this moment in time, behind sturridge and aspas, he wont get it. Hes at the age its vital to be playing. This is a good development stage for him and for Liverpool to see what he is all about. Just because lukaku is on loan again do you think his chelsea career is over. No its not.
ReplyDeleteWhen carrol went on loan, it wasnt to get games. We all new from the start he wasnt in BR's plans.
ReplyDeleteI wouldn't put Skrtel as DM, 1st touch and technique not god enough for that position imo. I could see us playing Ilori there though. Apparently he has a very good touch and technique as he started off as a striker. Can see him playing some games as DM in some cup games maybe.
ReplyDeleteBR wants borini to have games that's it. He was Injured for a long time, sitting on the bench won't help him, let him play games at Sunderland get his touch back then he can come back and have a crack at liverpool.
ReplyDeleterodgers is doing ok (it had more to do with the way kenny was treated if i am honest ,and rodgers trying to blame all his signings for everything imo)and as for fsg they are doing enough to keep fans on side ,but not much more ,with the players that have come in and the players that have left if you take wages and fees recieved into account ,over the course of a season i do not think we will have spent that much,also when rodgers comes out with statements like we have finished with squad players and are now after marque signings,for none to appear ,and at one stage he said the defence was strong and sorted ,only to go and sign another back four,you have to ask yourself ,what is he being told,
ReplyDeleteso the defenders can have a rest if they need to ,but the attackers will have to play if not fully fit,i find it quite incredible that we let one of the few strikers we have go on loan,whilst one of our strikers is suspended and the other as been playing dispite only being 70%fit
ReplyDeleteI mentioned in another thread, Illori might play (& do well) at DM position. I don't think without Europe, we need 6 CBs, but I guess, Skartel 'll be leaving shortly, so 'll be Coates once fit. Mamdou, Dan & Kolo are good enough, backed by the others.
ReplyDeleteHowever, with the purchase of so many CBs (recently bought another Spanish teenager), I guess BR doesn't rate the existing young CBs in our team or Academy. We have Coates, Kelly, Wisdom, Coady, Sama, Jones & few other young CBs, yet BR has bought 2 very good CBs, who potentially can play for a decade, which indicates he doesn't rate most of them that high. I think we might see a massive clear out in next few windows.
fair enough JC ,but it was only a couple of weeks ago you said we would get maybe a loan deal if we were lucky. that turned out to be not the case. So re the marquee signings, are you still saying we didn't go after Mhkitaryan, Costa and Willian, and it was just a smokescreen by |FSG to keep fans onside? Because I disagree if so. They did try, they weren't prepared to pay over their own valuations, and if it's their money, it's their right to set those valuations as they see fit.
ReplyDeletebut saying they're not doing much more than keeping fans onside? they spent £18m more than Spurs did this window....
If any CB is to play as makeshift DM, the best person is probably Agger. He has better ball skills & passing visions. Also, being left-footer, it's better to pair Mamadou with Skartel or Kolo. I think, Mamadou 'll start almost every match & depending on formation, opposition & fitness others 'll rotate.
ReplyDeleteWe only play with 1 usually, the top 3 interchange. Suarez rarely gets injured, he only misses 2 more League games.
ReplyDeleteAt first I was mad that we got Moses and the Bitters got Lukaku, but where would he have fitted in our fluid style? he's a focal point, a front man, and he would need to have assurances of playing to move to us, would you put him in instead of Suarez or Sturridge?
It's impossible to decode what Rodgers says in this instance, he won't say bad things about a player generally and will want to send Borini away with a vote of confidence. Does he genuinely believe in the player? I have no idea. What I do know is that Borini is not a bad football player. He had a couple of difficult injuries and is still very young, even at Sunderland he'll be little more than a bit of raw talent and determination. This could be a season to make him because a few goals will make a massive difference to his confidence. I think everyone will be happy to see him do well and if it happens then great, we'll either have a player worth some money on the re-sale or we'll have a confident striker to come in any challenge for a spot. Here's to hoping him the best at Sunderland, it certainly does us no harm if he helps make them a better team.
ReplyDeleteAs for the prediction ... why bother? You were convinced Suarez was leaving, to the point of belittling anyone as "deluded" if they suggested otherwise, and yet a large majority of us told you very clearly that the club would be right to stand firm and not let it happen. You don't seem too interested in reflecting on that now that you've been proven wrong. Do you really want to include a 50/50 prediction in this current discussion?
It IS the point of this site Adam, though you do make some great points..
ReplyDeletenot infront of them no ,and yes suarez as not been injuried yet touch wood but what if he is and sturridge is then what ,borrini would be better than no one,unless we have a secret stevie nicol in our squad;-)
ReplyDeleteif rodgers keeps coming out with statements and the complete opposite happens imo it is embarrassing , but like i said he may be told certain thing,did we go after them players who knows ,we may have done but if the selling club value there player at 30 million and we only want to bid 20 then its not going to happen ,hence suarez is still hear it works both ways
ReplyDeleteSakho was a long time coming. We needed another left footed centreback to deputise for Agger. We are however very heavy on the right footed front with Toure, Ilori and Skrtel. Coates is still with us and Rodgers did identify Wisdom as a future centreback.
ReplyDeleteKelly/Ilori/Sakho/Cissokho does look like a very viable and interchangeable alternative to Johnson/Toure/Agger/Enrique.
The only person on the planet who thinks what you describe is 'embarassing' is you.
ReplyDeleteSo Suarez didn't leave. So what? My overall point has always been that he will leave sooner rather than later. He wanted to leave, and tried his damndest to make it happen, and as I've argued, he will leave. The whole circus will start up again in December, and he'll probably leave in January.
ReplyDeleteAnd to say someone is 'deluding' themselves is not belittlement. People say that about me all the time, but I don't care as it's not insulting. People delude themselves on a daily basis about dozens of things, including LFC.
And I stand by that: anyone who thinks Suarez doesn't want to leave and/or has any loyalty to LFC, is deluding themselves. And if people take that as an insult then grow a thicker skin.
but jaikie i am from mars and only visit your planet for the football,we used to have our own teams but lost to many balls ,and i think you will find quite a few of the martian lfc supporters club agree with me
ReplyDeleteI'm less concerned about the attackers, we have plenty of youngsters ready for games. But currently we have no back up mids at all because Allen is injured, but even Allen shouldn't be enough there should be at least 2 other mids available in the squad, especially now that BR is using 4-3-3 a lot.
ReplyDeletecoutiho is a midfielder as is aspas they are not out and out strikers so should be able to play there against the lesser sides
ReplyDeleteMaybe Coutinho but Aspas no way, not in centre mid. I mean as partners for Lucas not in front of him and Gerrard.
ReplyDeletehenderson would be ideal there hes got the engine to bomb up and down the pitch ,he could cover for gerrard ,i agree we have no one to cover for lucas ,
ReplyDelete...makes perfect sense, it is the red planet after all.
ReplyDeletelooks like you will have to put up with suarez for at least a few more months ,who knows you may even want him to stay come jan if you give him a chance
ReplyDeleteI agree with some things you've said on this post about what Rodgers says and also what FSG tell him, I read what you say without a bad attitude towards you unlike many. IMO the whole idea about marquee signings is BS. If you need a player and that player has a price, pay it and get him in, there's no need for a 'marquee' every transfer window. The club had tried to sign some big players with big prices but it didn't work out. I would not want someone like Willian for 30m anyway, it's overpriced. If FSG don't pay up it's fine because as you said it works both ways and that's how we kept Suarez.
ReplyDeleteWe also signed 3 players on deadline day so you can't slate ambition. If Toure did not get injured arguably 2 of those deals may not have happened, but overall I would give FSG the benefit of the doubt so far.
As for Rodgers, I like what he's trying to achieve and at first I disagreed with his decisions such as assuming every Kenny signing was rubbish, like Henderson. But over time he's pulled it together and this season after a solid start there shouldn't be any excuses, especially after signing 3 players on the deadline.
Just some thoughts :)
No, I still want Suarez to leave. And he will leave sooner rather than later.
ReplyDeleteHe deserves no chance mate. If we keep up the wins Suarez would not even make my match day squad. He doesn't deserve to be in the current LFC environment which is the most positive it's been for years.
ReplyDeleteThat's exactly what BR is thinking, am sure.
ReplyDeleteagree
ReplyDeleteWhether he deserves it is now a moot point, he's got it. He's already added the caveat of "for a while" in his latest statement....he still wants out but knows he's got to just get on with it for now. I'd like to see him do everything he can to win the fans back over, help get us back into the top four ....and then be sold for £50m plus.
ReplyDeletethis time, i would agreed with you. Borini, will be sell for another year. This loan is juz to increasing this value to sell. Juz like Caroll.
ReplyDeleteHe already play to u21 match. Even so, im still not convinced with his performance if i am a scout. We say thank to him coz of his 2 goal there. But im still not convinced. In this point. im really and totally agreed with you.
There are few player been loaned to see further his development. I would see, its juz Suso, Robinson ( he decided later on) and even Wisdom. But, we dont forget that Borini is juz u23 player who can development tremendously, but until its so BR will considered it. If not, he will be sell later, juz like Spearing, Caroll and even downing. :)
we have had a fantastic start ,i do not expect top four ,but i do expect us to be knocking on the door asking questions ,if we are no nearer than 6th then ? will have to be asked ,can we blame rodgers if the signings were not made or is it down to fsg,imo fsg control the money so they should take the most blame,we have a chance of doing something special this season,with a lot of the other top clubs swapping and changing,but a lot will depend on injuries ,lets just hope we can for the most part stay injury free
ReplyDeleteyes maybe borini has not been the greatest of strikers, but you can't compare him to carroll. 25 million euros was wasted on Carroll for about the same goals to game ratio, if anything, it shows FSG has improved, although not very much :D. But looking at the transfer window I am very very happy with what has happened this summer. And borini is only 22, he still has time to grow.
ReplyDeletesorry mate but we have to disagree on this one suarez should be the 1st name on the teamsheet if hes fit and mentally ready to play ,if theres any chance of champions league then he has to be performing
ReplyDeletei would say agreed with jamie this year. If he grow tremendously, he will be slot in to the club. If not, sure he will be sell later.
ReplyDeleteHis loan was juz to increase his value which goin down after conceded 2 major injury in a year. Juz like what been happen to Spearing and Caroll. Even downing.
Anyway, Suarez has not been injured but he has been suspended for 10 games on average per season he's been here. That's as bad as a 10 week injury. I don't believe for a second he's lost his fire completely so even if he doesn't get a long ban again this season, I could see him picking up a suspension or two on yellows alone. The refs have it in for him so it won't take much. I agree that we needed another striker but I also understand Borini needed to go on loan. What 21-year-old wants to be third choice with a world cup coming up. I really expected an old head to come in on a free transfer and I wouldn't have minded Albelda on a free from Valencia to strengthen DM. Sure he's 35 and his best years are behind him but he was the very best and I'm sure Lucas could learn a thing or two from him.
ReplyDeleteI think Aspas actually played as a targetman for Celta
ReplyDeleteTo be fair, back in May/June/July, you were throwing a lot of "I told you so" around because Suarez was angling to leave. Maybe you didn't use those exact words (then again maybe you did), but there was definitely an element of it.
ReplyDeleteAnd to be perfectly frank, I've come around on the idea of selling him sooner rather than later and even admitted myself that his leaving was essentially inevitable.
But he hasn't left. Like @Mike Aitcheson I figured Suarez was 95% gone.
I guess we are all wrong... at least for now.
Yes, and I did so because Suarez had turned round and stabbed LFC in the back, just as I'd predicted.
ReplyDeleteErr, then we would either play moses or would just recall Borini. At least Borini might have his touch and confidence back by then plus match fitness and more game experience in the PL as a CF
ReplyDeleteif we have the power to recall him ,we may not it will depend on the terms of the loan ,i wonder if chelsea can just get moses back
ReplyDeleteWell the truth is that despite that, chances are that he will score a decent amount of goals for LFC this season, and we need that to get the top 4. Afetr we do, he can do one as far as I'm concerned.
ReplyDeleteWe have proven that LFC is bigger than LS or any other player for that matter, and we've helped redress the player power balance somewhat.
Suarez will never now be loved in the way he was before, but most supporters see the need for his output, at least for now.
So whether he goes in Jan, June, or not at all, I'm hoping he can replicate the goals tally he had last season, and we can replace him at our own convenience, not his
I'm not wrong though! That's the point. I've stated repeatedly that Suarez would be 'likely to leave', and that he'd try his best to leave, and that is exactly what happened: he was likely to leave, and he did try his best to engineer an exit. I never said absolutely he WOULD leave. That is just a myth being spun by the likes of you and Adam Griffin.
ReplyDeletewhy will he never be loved by the supporters again ,some fans still like owen and mcmanaman ,who both left the club in worse circamstances imo ,if suarez can produce the same form as last year and gets us champions league he will be forgiven ,even if we do not and he leaves if the club have said he can ,and he plays his heart out many fans will always love him,myself included
ReplyDeleteI completely agree. I really could not care less what Suarez really thinks about the club or his perceived loyalty or lack thereof. What he otherwise wants in his career means very little because he has a contract and LFC have just shown what that means. His little tantrum turned out to be just that: a tantrum. It's over now and until the next window rolls around he is a guaranteed Liverpool player. All that matters to us is what he produces on the pitch, both in training and in competitive matches. If he shows the same commitment and effort as last season then it's not an issue. His non-football related behaviour is another matter, but in terms of him playing and being a part of the squad - that's based purely on his willingness to do what he does best.
ReplyDeletei would call that getting off on a technicality
ReplyDeletehe mite have i would not want him playing as a target man for us
ReplyDeleteJust I admit Mate King Kenny set us back three years. We all love him but he messed up. Kenny got paid 15 Million before he left. In any team if you spend 100 Million and come in 8th you are highly getting fired. We all got frustrated over the summer for missing signings but we can just pay over the odds.
ReplyDeleteSorry mate but you sounding like the Chelski fans who wanted Benitez to fail so he can be fired.
so whats rodgers excuse he had another 40 odd million on top of kennys and got 7th and no cups and no european football whatsoever,i am all for being fair but rodgers record just before xmas was on a par with hodgeson and he got sacked as well,its called double standards ,i hope rodgers dose well but maybe if had given kennys players a bit of a go more mite have come good like hendo,and then we get to signings some fans go on as if all kennys signings were poor,well rodgers as hardly covered himself in glory in the transfer market you can all harp on about is january transfers,but what about last summers allen benched ,borrini loaned out assaidi gone suhin did not even last half a season,so if kennys signings set us back 3 years ,rodgers summer signings set us back at least another year
ReplyDeleteSorry, but that's pathetic.
ReplyDeleteIn all probability means that it is highly likely. Almost certain. No way would you or most of the posters here put something down to so many vagaries as a transfer as a fact .
The fact that you repeated your view so many times showed that you thought it would happen. It didn't. You were wrong. Suarez is still here.
You want another myth? Show me where I said you stated that Suarez WOULD leave. I said you were wrong about him being likely to leave. Others said that LFC would not allow him to leave, no one I saw contended that he had no intentions of doing so; they said it wouldn't happen.
As it turned out, YOU WERE WRONG. So was I .
Those people were right. Trying to justify it by predicting his departure some time in the future is simply misdirection.
Leaving sooner or later? Your own examples were 17 MONTHS ago, and he can't possibly leave for another 4. That's 21 months for something you call sooner rather than later?
VERY persuasive...../
Maybe he knows OJ's lawyers....
ReplyDeleteAnd I don't think that explanation qualifies.
QC: Mr Kanwar, was it your opinion that Suarez would leave LFC? Please restrict your answer to yes or no.
Answer: Over to you JK........
He used KK players and we got to 7th with exception of Andy Carrol. So what does that tell you??Sahin came in thinking he was better than everybody else and even Jonjo showed him, he can take his position. Right now he has his own players so judge him on how he does. Uncle Roy was a bad deal from the beginning and am sure you were in the stands shouting D A G L I S H name too.
ReplyDeleteKenny signings:Carroll-rubbish, Adam-rubbish Coates-rubbish,downing-poor doni-poor, only good signings Bellamy and Suarez and hendo.BR-borini-not good, assaidi-not good sahin(3 goals not bad but didnt settle) good signings in, mignolet,Toure,sahko,Sturridge,coutinho,apsas(looks a tidy player excellent technique) Alberto-20 bright future, Ilori-shrewd signing. Allen-tidy player who getting better. So overall BR is better in the market, league? BR is better. Overall BR is better.
ReplyDeleteCheers, for the record I think the way he's gone about things is totally shabby and actually do care about the things you mention, as I suspect you do too really but, as we both agree, he's here so there's no choice but to just get on with it.
ReplyDeleteNo, I said in the way he was before.
ReplyDeleteA lot of fans, myself included, felt let down that he agitated so much for a move after the backing he received from the fans and the club. I still want him here, but don't feel the same way.
Think Hilary/Bill Clinton after the Monica Lewinsky affair, and you're on the right lines. ...
I think Ilori will see some playing time as a DM just like Rafa did with David Luiz for Chelsea
ReplyDeleteBrendan Is not an LFC legend. Kenny is.
ReplyDeleteBut the ONLY things where Kenny 2 had a better record vs Rodgers is two things:
Conceding 3 less goals (although only scoring 47 all season vs 71 so was trounced on GD)
And winning the Carling Cup. A feat replicated by Birmingham the year they were relegated.
Saying Rodger had £40m ON TOP of Kenny's is NOT the same as if Rodgers Had £140m to spend himself. The squad Kenny left was still poor, with many end of career/unfit for purpose /overpaid players. Our squad now is considerably better, with just a few passengers left for now and loads more depth.
There's no measurable way to show Kenny 2 to be better. Sorry.
No, you and I were wrong. Not JK.
ReplyDeletehe spent 40 million and got 7th
ReplyDeletei agree to an extent but at least he was open and honest about it unlike the players who i mentioned ,who promised the club they would sign a new contract only to shaft us
ReplyDeleteWas that to me or someone else? haha because I didn't say kenny was better. :-)
ReplyDelete22 is about the same age as carroll another player who didn't fit the system...
ReplyDeleteill be honest i thought he would 100 per cent leave..i was wrong ( first time for everything ) ill still only believe hes not gone when i see him playing haha
ReplyDeletehes certainly mental
ReplyDeleteway off base pal...rogers wants him out
ReplyDeletewhere not dealing in absolutes mike where dealing in probabilities....the kind of guarantees you want dont exist i cant even say for 100% that i am not dreaming this...i think there fore i am is about the closest i can come with in the logic of your argument with JK.....
ReplyDeletethey say all brilliant minds have a bit of madness in them,as me and you both know,its just a cross we have bare
ReplyDelete"Way off" how would you know? Borini has gone out for games he isn't going to play down the middle. He will go. Out and prove him self.
ReplyDeleteIts like you say. Liverpool, for me have only 2/3 strikers, if he's not good enough to be cover in the current squad, what's going to change after a year? If in the next window or the summer window,Suarez leaves The club, Liverpool will buy 1,2 or 3 top players as replacements, meaning he has zero chance of playing again.
ReplyDeleteHe played the most impressive football of his career in a wide position in a front three for Roma. Not sure why you insist on repeatedly claiming he isn't a wide player. Any thoughts on that?
ReplyDeleteabsolutely right Jamie,Suarez is just placating the fans until he gets what he wants.When Torres left i could not see us getting a better player in but along came Suarez.I feel that Liverpool have already identified Suarez's replacement so i am perfectly happy and prepared for him to move on.Good luck to him i say Liverpool will be OK without him just as we were post Torres.
ReplyDeleteNo they cant recall Moses, coz we paid for him to come here,
ReplyDeleteSunderland did not pay for Borini, just his salary.
why has Rodgers left us light up front again? O.K. Borini is'nt up to it at Anfield, nor will he be. Remember Rodgers saying the fans would love him? Looks like we'll have to rely on kids to cover Suarez and the injury prone Sturridge. Rodgers can be quite inept at times.
ReplyDeleteI think BR now accepts he made errors buying Borini, and to a lesser extent Allen, who was wonderful in his early games for us.
ReplyDeleteBut the fact that he is doing something about it is good, he is progressing as a Manager by learning from his mistakes. I agree Borini wont be back (85%)
If BR can recoup what we paid for him, and learn from his mistake, for me its ok.
How noticeable it is the progress BR himself has made, not just the players he has improved. I like lots of others was doubting his ability to Manage a Club of our stature, but he is doing okay since his dodgy early months in the job. Dropping Allen, moving Borini on shows his progress. Lets hope he benefits from it, and his staunch defence of Suarez, only to get stabbed in the back. You never know, we might have found a good one in BR.
This is just a waste of time. That is not how opinions on football work. I stated many times that:
ReplyDeletea) It was highly likely that Suarez would leave.
b) He had no loyalty to LFC, and if the club didn't finish in the top 4, he would try and force a move.
You are now trying to twist my argument with your revisionist chicanery. I never made an absolute statement. I never said 'Suarez WILL leave'. I merely read between the lines (as I always do) and suggested that the chances of him leaving would increase exponentially this summer.
And I was right, whether you choose to accept it or not. I get things wrong, and if I do, I'll admit it, but in this case, I'm not wrong.
I don't think he's out of the plans, just 22, and out injured for most of the year, he badly needs game time, and no matter how you look at it he won't get it in the first team unless we are really unlucky and both sturridge and Luis are injured.. I watched the U21 game when he scored 2 he certainly can play, but like DS he needs to play.. And AC I always liked him but always has a niggle and LFC's style of football under BRi is not for him.. and sorry I'm always posting comments eon's after, I'm just busy with work and stuff only get to read them late in the day. I voted for him to be back and why not, how the hell can you just think a 22 year old is not going to make it.. look at Bale useless 2011-12... Drogba took him an awful long time to make it.. horses for courses. In football someone needs to believe in you, next manager and you're gone. sadly a cut throat world. Not sure I'm posting this where I really intended.. but my bad to tired to sort it. Sorry
ReplyDeleteI never once accused you of making an absolute statement either. So who's the revisionist?
ReplyDeleteAnd I'm challenging your argument, not twisting it. My understanding of your posts was that you thought Suarez would leave LFC. If that's right, then that considered belief proved to be incorrect whatever the likelihoods were: he stayed.
If my understanding of your belief was wrong, then you were correct in not believing that he would leave.
Enough of going round in circles now. At least one of us is happy that he stayed. and that, as people say to Chris Tarrant, is my final answer...
I am a massive Rafa fan as you know.
ReplyDeleteI really don't know if our defenders got injured if we were ever really going to sign the two we did in transfer window . Would of been Monster window if we signed a Mata type player.
Don't like FSG But they have supported the manager .
The cover we have For lucas gerrard not there.
But I am warming to Rodgers and I think he has done very well with the owners and the market he has given me hope which was not there . arsenal has Ramsey Wilshere for there future. gerrard not getting younger we need that world class replacement there to learn from him .
Get El-Shwdy from Milan this Jan..a better and clinical Italian Striker
ReplyDeleteSunderland did pay a fee, similar amount to what we paid for Moses.
ReplyDeleteYeah, I exaggerate, there is a part of me that certainly would prefer things to be different. It would be nice. Still, I think we can all get over our discontent and focus on the football. There is no doubt that Suarez holds very little loyalty for the club, and that's not exactly a good thing, but at the same time it should not affect our ability to compete. My message is generally that we should perhaps spend less time getting all angsty over Suarez and just allow him to be who he is, stop expecting him to be something else, at least in terms of needing him to "love" LFC and desperately want to be here. The club will hold him to a standard of performance and behaviour, that should be enough. If he performs and gives that same effort on the pitch then we can put aside our issues at least for those 90 minutes a week.
ReplyDeleteAnd BR made that very clear. There was no "I believe in Andy Carroll" message, I think he could barely stop himself from saying "the lad has no future at this club". This is different, but it's hard to really know if Rodgers is serious about having Borini for the future. He could believe in the player and still not think he's right for us.
ReplyDeleteThis is just a sick article Mr. Jamie Kanwar. I have been silently following your article since 2 yrs but from some of ur bad article this one is the worst if borini going on loan means his carrier is over then how abt suso?? And wisdom loan deal fell through due to Johnson injury otherwise hisccarrier would have also been finished look at some loan player who made it most sturride, wilshere, nasri so at least motivate them and pls allen is never a flop guy cos gerrard currently occupies his place and I have full belief he is one for the future. ...
ReplyDeleteJaimie dont u think if we qualify for the europe we will still b short of strikers look at city they have at least 5 to 6 strikers so dont b overconcerned...
ReplyDeleteThink you are way off on Allan he's vital when Rodgers wants to play possession football, Henderson should get the nod in the big games as he offers more... You only need to look at the game Vs Notts County where we dominated until Allan's injury.... To have options in midfield insnt necessarily a bad thing to be flexibile and have the fluidity to change Gerrard, Lucus, Henderson, Allan, and Alberto will only be proven over a season not over a week/month... You're never going to get a squad of 15/18 top name players all happy to be on the bench or in the rotation!
ReplyDeleteAs a third option I don't think he'd be too bad. He's got fight in him. A bit like Kuyt. I wouldn't want him to lead our line week in, week out either but let's face it, we weren't going to convince the likes of Lukaku to come to Anfield to be third choice. If you play targetman, like we do, you're going to have to accept you can't have three superstar strikers in your squad
ReplyDeleteI find it commendable that people still count on Kelly but we have to understand that Rodgers can't for now. So for now Wisdom and Johnson are our right backs as is Flanagan although I fear for him. Shame if he doesn't make it. He seemed to have so much promise.
ReplyDeleteFantastic player, never understood why we sold him. He's had horrible luck with injuries though so it would be like signing one sicknote as cover for another. Too much risk in that. As I said above, David Albelda on a free.
ReplyDeleteDon't forget the extra 25 to 30 goals extra he was looking to bring to the team.
ReplyDeleteThen on the LAST day of the window we bring defenders in. They must of been bought in for football reasons as other areas of the squad look short to me too.
What the manager wanted and what he got were 2 different things.
I don't think confidence is Borini's problem. His problem is that he is behind one of world's top five players and currently the best striker in the Premiership. He just isn't good enough to challenge those two. Never will be either. That's his problem.
ReplyDeleteAs if you r the only person who knows everything abt football and we are dumb, why won't you try to become liverpool manager u could even surpass shankly and paisely...
ReplyDeleteAbsolutely. There is no room for petty resentment when it comes to the good of the club. The club say Suarez has apologised and the squad seem to have welcomed him back. He's back in training smiling and comes to every match. On the surface of it, it seems like his mind is in the right place again. Sure he will still want to leave if we're 7th in January or May and he's entitled to imo. For now, he's a Liverpool player and one of the best we have and he needs to play when he's available. If we do qualify for the Champions League this year, selling him would be the most stupid thing we could do unless the money is ridiculous. Suarez in our lineup could be the difference between playing in the Champions League and competing to win it. A frontline of Coutinho Sturridge Suarez is as good as any other in the world. Add someone to replace Coutinho so he can play behind Sturridge and we'll be sensational at the top end of the pitch.
ReplyDeleteOnly those who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do.
ReplyDeleteI never understood the Borini buy and he was a huge mistake. However, I can't understand why he's been sent out on loan while Suarez is still suspended. Sturridge isn't fully fit and there are two internationals coming up. If his injury flares up, Liverpool are left only with Aspas.. Daft decision
ReplyDeleteWhat utter tripe, this is a completly different situation to Carroll. What BR says is true, Borini needs game time to get back up to a level at which he can challenge for a first team spot. Sturridge, Suarez and Aspas are plenty of cover for the one striking spot in the team.
ReplyDeleteBorini going out on loan could be a great move, just think back to how Strurridge himself flourished when he went to Bolton on loan from Chelsea or Jack Wilshire who also developed alot as a player at Bolton on loan.
henderson could well be that man
ReplyDeletebut whos fault is it ,whos choosing the signings ,we should be ok to the next window ,lets just hope we do not suffer major injuries
ReplyDeletefair enough ,but the voice of reason says differently,we did pay a fee for moses ,but did they for borrini ,if they were loads of clubs interested i think we would have got a fee
ReplyDeletewe are supposed to be playing tikka takka ,we do not use target men
ReplyDeleteSo what are Neymar and Torres? Or Soldado? Or Negredo?
ReplyDeletesorry misunderstood to me a target man is a big strong player someone like benteke
ReplyDeleteAh, for me it's the lone strike up front you look to target to finish off the movement.
ReplyDeleteWise words, oddly enough he's probably one of the few players who would be able to stay focussed on the field after all this, firstly because he's so used to causing sh*t storms and secondly because I don't think he tries to win for the team as such but himself, it's like it's a very personal challenge/battle every time he steps out, and that won't change. I just hope we don't go back to automatically funnelling everything to him as he can be wasteful, but BR seems to have already laid down a marker of sorts by moving him out wide. Good to see. If LS, DS and PC click it should be beautiful on the eye, and the league table.
ReplyDeleteWe already have 2 young players coming through who should be given a chance at CB in cup games.
ReplyDeleteSince Rodgers took over Agger and Gerrard have played in more games in a season than they have ever done. There was a article wrote about this somewhere suggesting it was the new training methods being employed that were keeping them more injury free.
Unless we are going to play 3 at the back, I really can't see why we needed 2 new CB'S in this window while we only have 2 1st team forwards on the books now. I just hope 1 of them doesn't sulk when he comes back.
I understand what you are saying but can we really rely on Suarez? He is already on a ban and I wonder how long it will take before he gets himself banned again. I really hope he puts the effort in when he comes back too..... A 40m striker training alone doesn't fill me with confidence.
ReplyDeleteAspas is another option but I feel he is not strong enough to play that role yet.
Sitting top of the league with a run of fixtures that could go a long way in defining what kind of season we have and I feel short changed when I look at the kind of players our rivals signed.
100% agree with this.
ReplyDeleteGuys..im not too worried about DM position in the event Lucas gets injured. Toure, with his defensive and distribution as well as tackling skills, can be a temporary replacement. Especially with the numbers of defenders we can employ in games from now on. Illori is also an option. I guess thats why Rodgers bought him..ie a player who are adaptable and can play in many positions.
ReplyDeleteAnother option is, but not as a regular, is Agger. At least for a few games, Agger's body can take it i think.
Similar to Sakho, who can also play as a left back. And Moses who can play at either wing. The manager has these players who can cover for various positions.
Tho i in a way agree on the main striker spot. Would have loved to have an out and out striker to finish up all the chances we are creating. But hey..we are in a better state that we were before. So hopefully the goals will start be coming in soon..once the players gel and understand ine another
Agreed. Luis isn't making complex moral or ethical decisions when he goes out to play. He just gives everything because he can't stand to lose. He knows no other way to approach football except all-out determination. So long as he's not too distracted by something else I think he'll be no different this season. Maybe there is a chance his thinking about a different club or his dissatisfaction with Liverpool will creep into his mind. I don't think it will, or at least I certainly hope very much it doesn't.
ReplyDeleteBR knows how to get the best out of him tactically so I would never expect anything other than a formation which will be best for the club, not for Luis. When he was our only star then it might have been different, but we've got different players now, he's not our only threat, and he has to accept that maybe his role on the ball will have to change to accommodate that.
Interesting comment coming from Lazio that they were interested in signing Borini permanently. Maybe they wanted a cut-down price, but it seems to me if Rodgers really didn't see a future here for Borini that he'd simply let the kid go and cut his losses. Lazio were previously willing to pay 8 million pounds for Burak Yilmaz so if that's their budget for a striker I can't see why Rodgers would send him away for a year and risk his value dropping more. This isn't a rumour, although the report itself could be totally bogus, who knows, but it seems factual enough and re-reported by Sky. Lazio wanted to buy Borini on a permanent basis. So any suggestion the player is destined to return to Serie A seems wide of the mark. If we take the story and the various comments on face value then it is indeed the case that Rodgers wants Borini to have more games in the PL to see if he can gain some confidence and form so that he can return next season to challenge for a place in the squad. Otherwise surely we would have negotiated an exist fee and just let him go. We've done precisely that with other players who have no future here, why would Borini be different?
ReplyDelete