11 Aug 2013

Debunking LFC Myths: No 12 - Brendan Rodgers lied to Luis Suarez over Anfield exit

The Luis Suarez transfer fiasco continues to fester at Anfield, and a growing number of disgruntled, overwrought Suarez apologists continue to spread the baseless falsehood that Reds boss Brendan Rodgers 'lied' about letting the Uruguayan leave this summer. Based on the available evidence, this is categorically untrue, and fair-minded person who considers the situation objectively will see that.

Let's get straight to the point. Suarez claims the following:

"I’ve done enough to be playing in the Champions League. Now there’s an option for me to do that and I want very much to take it.

"They [Liverpool] gave me their word a year ago and now I want them to honour that. It’s not just something verbal with the coach but something written in the contract"


The CLUB that negotiates/drafts contract terms, NOT the manager. Whatever the 'verbal' agreement between Suarez and Rodgers, it is not a binding legal agreement, and there's no proof whatsoever that Rodgers made any kind of ancillary extra-contractual promise to Suarez. Indeed, Rodgers specifically denies this:

“There were no promises made - categorically none - and no promises broken. Obviously, the remarks I’ve read, it is bitterly disappointing - but my job is bigger than that. My job is to fight and protect the club"

Rodgers is an honest, honourable man, and there is nothing in his long-career to suggest otherwise. Suarez, on the other hand, has a track record of cheating (which is inherently dishonest), and a long history of negative behaviour on the pitch.

Additionally, the fact that the FA found Suarez's evidence to be 'unreliable' and 'inconsistent' during the Evra debacle speaks volumes in and of itself, and (arguably) has a direct bearing on this situation. The FA reports states:

"Mr Suarez's evidence was unreliable in relation to matters of critical importance...and seriously undermined the reliability of his evidence on other matters. There were also inconsistencies between his accounts given at different times as to what happened."

I do not suggest that Suarez is lying here; it's more likely that he misunderstood and/or misinterpreted the scope and meaning of the alleged contract clause in question. This is supported by a statement from Gordon Taylor, the head of the Professional Footballers' Association (PFA), who confirmed the following earlier this week:

* The PFA is 'in touch with both parties to see if some resolution can be achieved'
* There is no standard buyout clause in Suarez's contract.

According to Taylor - who has seen the clause in question - Suarez's contact actually states that:

- IF there is no qualification for the Champions League, AND:
- A minimum offer of £40 million comes in, then:
- Liverpool will discuss the possibility of a sale, but:
- It [the clause] 'does not say the club has to sell'.

Taylor further explains:

"It [the contract clause] quite clearly states £40million is a minimum offer for discussions. There is a 'good faith' clause in relation to serious discussions but I can't say it is a cast-iron buy-out clause"

This patently does NOT constitute a 'promise' to Suarez that Liverpool would let him leave upon failure to qualify for the Champions League. All it means is that the Reds have a 'good faith' duty to *consider* selling the Uruguayan if both parts of the clause are satisfied.

The key point here is there is no element of strict liability. Liverpool didn't qualify for the Champions League, and Arsenal made a £40m bid for Suarez, but all this requires the club to do is enter discussions to sell. It does NOT require the club to actually sell.

As such, if - as is likely - Rodgers merely repeated the content of this contract clause in his 'verbal' exchange with Suarez, then, as a matter of irrefutable fact, he did not lie. It is far more probable that Suarez's understanding of the clause is incorrect. Some further things to consider:

* There is nothing in Suarez's statement above to suggest that the 'verbal' agreement is different to the content of the contractual clause.

* If Suarez's issue is that the verbal agreement IS different to the contractual clause - i.e. Rodgers made him a promise that differed from the his contract - why mention the contract at all, and why not make this distinction specifically clear in his comments?

* Suarez can be stupid on the pitch, but are we to seriously believe that he is stupid enough to publicly accuse LFC of LYING on the basis of an unprovable verbal agreement?!

The only lying going on here is by Suarez apologists, who are desperately trying to smear Rodgers with their false accusations.



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123 comments:

  1. liverpool4life5659:18 pm, August 11, 2013

    Nice article and it would put some people straight :-)

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  2. This article does nothing to prove either way. I'm unmoved by Suarez's claim, if he's dumb enough not to sort out a clause properly then he needs to suffer the consequences.

    Would I be surprised if BR promised he could leave? No. Would I be surprised if LS misunderstood the clause? No. Would I be surprised if LS is lying? No

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  3. great article suarez trying to play the victim card hard luck suarez

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  4. How does it not prove anything 'either way'? You seem to ignore the fact that Taylor has seen the contract clause in question, and it quite clearly does not state that Suarez must be sold if LFC fail to qualify for the CL.

    There is absolutely no evidence to suggest Rodgers made any kind of personal promise to Suarez, and that is not what Suarez said anyway. He said that 'they' i.e. the club 'gave their word', which clearly implies that his complaint is based on what's written in his contract.

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  5. Suarez's problem shouldn't be with Liverpool.


    His problem should be with his agent for not making the clause more ironclad in his favor.


    After all, no one forced him to sign the contract extension.


    I read earlier that FSG and the Glazers have an agreement together that they won't sell a player (Suarez & Rooney) who wants to leave and go to another rival. Essentially they are determined to take away a player's power to wake up one morning and decide he doesn't like his contract any more and force a move.


    I like the strong-handed nature that LFC is using to take care of this situation. I just hope that if we truly don't sell him, that he will give his all since it's a world cup year and we can sell him in either January or next summer for a larger fee...

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  6. if, hypothetically, we sold him to arsenal and they failed to beat fenerbache, it would be interesting to see if he would try to wriggle out of that contract due to no champs lge. or, what wonderful piece of bullsh*t would he spout then?

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  7. I ignore nothing, I'm not disputing the contract. But like I said, you (and I) have no idea what the club have or have not said to Suarez about him leaving this summer. So nothing is debunked. Suarez is clearly talking about a verbal agreement that may or may not have taken place and not what is in his contract.

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  8. Maybe the press are s**t staring and twisting the words , only have to look at some of the sites already and there saying "Suarez is not going to apologise " as Suarez even spoke to any about this in last 24 hours? I doubt it, maybe we shouldn't take much notice of them and opposing fans because its LFC and Suarez that are getting damaged here ! And the other parties are all loving it, lets see if Suarez returns and says sorry , ROLL ON THE 3rd September ! I can't wait.

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  9. The most irritating part is the statement: "I have done enough to play CL football". If he did that his club would have participated in the CL this year. I think the saddest aspect in all this is the fact that LS thought his fate and his club's fate should be viewed separately! This is where the disrespect comes in. If the team failed to qualify for CL, LS is equally responsible as every other member of the team. There were many games where LS participated and the team lost or drawn games. Why shouldn't LS take responsibility for that? What gives him the right to jump ship despite his contractual obligation unless the club wants him to move on by mutual consent?


    Having said this, I wanted him gone on the day he bit Ivanovic but I don't want him to go to a direct competitor in the league. IMO, if a foreign suitor comes, LFC should sell him immediately.

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  10. What the club verbally did or did not say is totally irrelevant, as it is not binding. What matters is what stands up under the law, and that is Suarez's contract.

    And sorry, but Suarez is not talking about a verbal agreement. He stated:

    "They [Liverpool] gave me their word a year ago and now I want them to honour that. It’s not just something verbal with the coach but something written in the contract"



    He specifically references 'something written in the contract', and dismisses the verbal aspect. Clearly, his main focus is the contractual clause.


    Suarez can be stupid on the pitch, but he's not stupid enough to base his whole power play on an unprovable verbal agreement.

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  11. Simply put, if Suarez wanted that promise made, he should have put it in the contract.


    It makes zero sense why LFC would have him sign a contract and then make him a verbal promise afterward that essentially is the opposite of what's in the contract.

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  12. If suarezhad not of bittin the guy and then said nothing about a move hewould proably be in madrid or paris now. But he didn't he and his agent must be really stupid people. Starting to get worried we ain't gona sign anyone else this window. Maybe that's why lfc so desperate to keep him til january at least.

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  13. i agree that we do need to get rid of him to someone outside these shores. does he not question himself, as to why, only arsenal appear interested? saying that, i still think it's a bit of a smokescreen from wenger, to keep the afc fans at bay. he doesn't want to spend anything other than about 8m on some croatian 'starlet', for the future, to join his 'ever eternal young players'.

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  14. As you quoted "it's not just something verbal" meaning something was in the contract and said to him verbally? So like I said, nothing is debunked, Suarez thinks the club said something BR claims they didn't.

    No I don't think he would go toe to toe on a verbal agreement, doesn't hide the fact he still thinks something was said to him

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  15. LOL Rodgers never stops going on about the champions league, I bet at the start of last season Brendan was clucking about qualification for the CL. In any case what you say here is that there was indication given to Suarez and I can't see any evidence of discussion or good faith from LFC. They rejected Arsenals offer out of hand because they (mistakenly) took it as an insult...

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  16. Verbal contracts aren't worth the paper they are printed on. Even if there was an unofficial agreement Suarez is the one in the wrong. He has clearly either told Arsenal about the so called clause in his contract or his advisors have (not allowed). That he misinterpreted the clause is the incompetence of whoever told him to sign it. The pound added by Arsenal was a cheap shot and I hope FSG refuse to sell to them no matter what. It's a matter of principle. We can't allow a player or other clubs especially rivals push us around. Either way I believe his position is untenable. He has disrespected the club yet again and we would be better off without him. If we can find a replacement or two I wouldn't allow him to pull on the shirt again and sell him to the highest bidder, preferably abroad. At this point I'd prefer he went to Chelsea even as much as I despise them. I respect the way Rodgers and the owners have handled the situation. It's been the making of them.

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  17. Nice article also cant agree with the media saying the pool cannot afford to leave him in the reserves? what what would the cost be to liverpool if we sold him to a rival and his goals got them to a CL place ahead of us what would the cost be then?? 50 mil?

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  18. Yes, but if the 'verbal' aspect was *different* to the contractual terms, then Suarez would've said so. That is, after all, what you're suggesting, is it not? That Rodgers made Suarez a separate promise?

    If that's true, why wouldn't Suarez make this explicitly clear in his comments? In fact, he basically *confirms* that the two 'promises' are the same:


    "It’s not just something verbal with the coach but something written in the contract"


    The objective meaning of this comment is that the 'promise' Suarez perceived was enshrined in the contract, as well as being made verbally.


    Again, if there was a different promise, Suarez would've said so. Why wouldn't he say so?

    There is no evidence that Rodgers has lied. That is the point being debunked here. If Rodgers has lied, where is your proof?

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  19. and who would that be people who have a mind of there own and not the sheep

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  20. You and I don't know what went on behind the scenes re Arsenal's bid. LFC and Arsenal may have discussed it over the phone, or even met, so the discussion requirement could've been fulfilled.

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  21. liverpool4life5659:57 pm, August 11, 2013

    Your a arsenal fan I'm sure....?

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  22. I'm not saying at all that the verbal agreement is different to what was written in the contract. I'm not even saying BR has lied. All I am saying is that Suarez is sure something was said which is being denied by BR. what? I have no idea. Like you always like to say there is no smoke without fire.

    It's BR's word against LS's word. In my eyes you have not cleared anything up at all.

    Would I trust Suarez? Not really. Saying that my respect for BR is on the decline after what was said about Reina.

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  23. suarez said there were on going verbal promises / assurances. Balance of probabilities suggests you are right, but we still don't know what was said between them. i agree it isn't fair to label Rodgers a liar

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  24. With respect, Suarez did not say there are 'ongoing verbal promises / assurances'. He stated:

    "They [Liverpool] gave me their word a year ago and now I want them to honour that. It’s not just something verbal with the coach but something written in the contract".

    You are embellishing his statement by adding extra stuff into it like 'ongoing' and 'assurances'. Only what he actually said should be considered.

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  25. If you still don't think that Suarez has people feeding stuff to the media you're a better man than me. The fact that the media have been pretty accurate on all his recent assertions even when some Liverpool fans were claiming mistranslation, should be a clue. The man is a troublemaking scrote. Face it.

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  26. here is the quote that interested me:


    "I spoke with Brendan Rodgers several times and he told me: 'Stay another season, and you have my word if we don't make it then I will personally make sure that you can leave.'"



    this is the phrase that people are interested in. it may well be total nonsense, but not impossible to believe either.

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  27. I think we can all agree its a mess,,,and its a mess that doesn't look like ending soon...rogers is demanding an apology Suarez wont apologise....that means we are going into the season a striker down relying on old brittle bones to stay fit

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  28. "Verbal contacts aren't worth the paper they're written on"
    Classic Colemanballs quote:-)

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  29. Jaimie, I think we need to realise that Suarez is just a footballer and not a legal eagle. What seems probable is that at the end of the 2011-12 season, Suarez has agreed to stay on another season and help LFC reach the Champions League. They've even gone so far as to have it written into his contract. The fact that Suarez's people haven't had it worded correctly doesn't change the probability that Suarez was under the impression he could leave if we didn't get CL and a bid of more than £40m was lodged.


    This is down to Suarez's agent/legal team who should have examined the contract more fully.


    Suarez is a human being (and a pretty wayward one at times) and not a financial institution/business. So being caught out on contractual wording isn't going to just get an 'oh darn it' response and he carries on as normal. I'm pretty sure he will sulk and disrupt for as long as he's there...


    So although BR didn't lie, I think it's fair to say that Suarez believed he could leave...Peace

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  30. No it says YOU were wrong in calling BR a liar!!! Admit it and you will feel better. lol!!!!

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  31. One of the most damning points for Suarez and his claim of a verbal agreement being made at the time of his contract is that a few months later in January of this year he gave an interview to the Daily Mail saying he would stay even if we didn't make CL....why make such a statement if there was already an agreement? It totally flies in the face of it if it existed. It makes no sense.

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  32. Fair enough. I don't believe that for a minute though, and I'd take Rodgers' word over Suarez any day.

    Sent from Samsung Galaxy Note

    -------- Original message --------

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  33. jamie do you own a samsung galaxy

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  34. JK Seriously you have laid down what all this week every outlet have been explaining as messy as it is. Why are you waisting your time on someone who cannot admit the fact that BR is in the clear. No matter what you say they will not want to agree. LS himself will come here and say the same thing you said and they will tell him exactly what they telling you now. Take a break from this man more and better things to discuss. Like why BR is not signing people and loosing my mind here. LFC is not deep enough they plaid well against Celtics but we still have the same problems.


    PS. Good Article!

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  35. rogers is an enabler to coin your phrase....he has defended suarez over cheating numerous times thus making him an unreliable witness

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  36. I can't wait for his next interview when he goes on international duty this week

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  37. SUAREZ says "I've done enough to be playing in the Champions League.Now there's a option for me to do that and i want very much to take it".There's a offer on the table for him to play a couple of CL qualifying matches.I wouldn't jump the gun FENERBAHCE will be no pushover especially at the Şükrü Saracoğlu stadium with the atmosphere their fans create.
    LS should stop moaning about a contract that doesn't support what he wants and concentrate on finding a new agent and lawyer because they f4cked up big time.PERE GUARDIOLA doesn't have a clue!

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  38. There's much nonsense. Rodgers is a Liverpool employee and just as transient as the players, so Rodgers could have been gone the day after any agrement would have been made. So unless the contract has such clauses Suarez is being badly advised. Nor was Rodgers under pressure to deliver 4th in his first season - this coming season was always to be his barrometer so why would he make such a promise on the basis of a target he wasn't set? Either way, Suarez seems determined to burn his bridges with the club. We just have to hope that Spurs keep Bale, leaving Madrid needing to spend big to appease their own fans!

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  39. Every time he gets in hot water he dissembles, blaming everyone but himself. Great footballer? Absolutely. Honourable person? No

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  40. He believed he could leave because his camp obviously didn't understand the wording of the clause....in my opinion the verbal agreement stuff is just another attempt in his ever changing justifications for wanting to leave. It's BS from LS.

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  41. This LIverpool team, even with Suarez is nowhere near good enough for a top 4 spot. So whereas I can appreciate the argument against selling him to an Arsenal (for instance) in reality it would make no difference at all and Suarez knows that.


    My question is, why put a clause like this in there at all if there wasn't some sort of discussion between club and player as to his future in the event Liverpool didn't qualify for the CL. Sounds like there's more to it than being disclosed by Liverpool IMO.

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  42. I can see how such a clause can be so confusing....why even put such an amount of 40m..they should just say that 40m or 50m was a buyout clause,.....putting 40m as a minimum amount just adds confusion...
    Suarez has history of dishonesty, but Liverpool are no saints either.

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  43. Me too.... by then he will wave a piece of paper which he claims is signed by Joe Anderson who as the first elected Mayor of Liverpool trumps FSG according to Luis and Joe says he can go.... and also to have had discussions with the Dalai Lama who will apparently completely backs him and has promised he can be reincarnated as a Gooner.

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  44. Was Brendan Rodgers even appointed at the time Suarez is making his claim about?

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  45. Suarez signed a new contract just a wee bit over a year ago, so yeah he was. He couldn't get that wrong too!

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  46. It's obvious that Suarez is lying. He wants out and is trying everything he can to do so. I believe the only thing Liverpool and Rodgers would have said to him is that if we fail to qualify for the CL then we will consider offers above £40 million. That's why there is a clause in his contract stating so. What i can't understand about all this is why he is trying so hard for a move to Arsenal (money maybe). I completely agree with our stance on Suarez moving to Arsenal for the obvious reason but if i was in charge i would have faxed all the big clubs in Europe who have serious money to spend and say you can have him for £40 million when he came out and said he wanted to leave (hopefully that is what we are doing).

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  47. I agree totally with Jaimie In all reality Suarez has caused a lot of damage he has made us look foolish and cast a lot of negative light over our great club on far to many occasions, he has lied and cheated on and off the field with his actions on the pitch, and of the pitch by telling lies to the supporters he also stated he was going to honour his contract with us and then started whoring himself out to other teams through the media , ironically using the same press he stated he wanted to leave for in the beginning. We really need to get rid of him he is driving me mad and I for one have had my fill of him

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  48. No-one is denying that there was a discussion....The point is what type of discussion it was... Suarez claimed the clause was something it wasn't, he also stated in January he would stay with LFC even if they did not qualify for the CL. LFC have at least been consistent in their position, unlike LS, in saying he has a contract and it doesn't allow for a transfer unless they feel it is right for LFC as well.

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  49. I think arsenal will lose the qualifier. however they can still make it because fenebrache has to still be cleared from there match fixing scandals, which I doubt will happen.

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  50. Totally agree mate! Suarez is a brat it's not all about poor little Luis other players in the team want success as do our loyal supporters the same supporters who gave Suarez total support, add 19 stupid and needless games banned for biting and the evra affair to the mix whilst we are at it. Sell him abroad as soon as possible and lets bring in a few new faces to try and help us push for a top four finish (here's hoping anyway)

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  51. I don't believe he misunderstood at all and I'll explain why. A) he clearly said when asked what if we didn't get the CL? He replied I have a contract with the club and I am happy and here will I stay. So this means he understood the contract so why say I have a contract and here will I stay. B) the bite, I said it then this was done on purpose because he felt that LFC would have to let him go after another bad incident, well I am sure if Madrid cane along they would have. No way would LFC sell to a rival unless it was silly money. C) I am certain that contracts would usually be checked by solicitors, if not that's the agents stupidity. D) he made up stories about wanting to leave due to media pressure now all if a sudden that's not a problem. Sorry but this brat is full of crap, he needs to go and I hope he does but not to a rival club. Maybe a foreign club will come for him in Jan but we will be in a weak position now to sell at a decent price, maybe this is something that he hopes for as going to Arse makes no sense at all.
    Good article btw

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  52. See where you are coming from but it's an even bleaker assessment of LS...it means he has no defence at all, not even ignorance. I think he thought he had an out via the clause but back in January wasn't contemplating it, the bite happens and he's had enough plus he thinks Real are coming in for him....voilà, he wants out. In your scenario he's coldly calculating, in mine he's opportunistic....either way he's got to go but on LFC's terms.

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  53. Jaimie, while I agree with the article, I disagree with one point. A verbal agreement can most definitely be a legally binding agreement. Legal Studies 101 :)

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  54. As I just mentioned above Jaimie, verbal contacts can be legally binding, just because it is not written doesn't mean that it wont stand up in court. Its just a lot harder to prove.

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  55. Well personally I think he is but like you said either way he needs to go. I think it's about time someone stood upto these type of players and hats off to both owners and BR not to cave in. Although I am surprised at Wenger going all out to get him and it's strange how on one hand he says nothing can happen unless all three parties agree and he has been clearly told there is no way the FSG will sell. Unless he has an agenda to unsettle him enough as so we don't stand no chance at all of competing against his team

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  56. It's all hearsay, the fact u can claim either is lying leads me to assume u were there. If you was not present when the promise was made/not made you are just a kop loser trying to save face.

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  57. Who knows what goes on behind closed doors. Unless one is privy to what goes on behind those closed doors, I'd rather keep a open mind. Taylor could be referring to a different clause than the so-called verbal promise Suarez is on about. Only so much one can gauge from the outside looking in and there isn't enough to 'debunk' in this case, at this stage. I'm no fan of Luis but there isn't enough here to believe that was or was not a verbal promise/word between Suarez and Rodgers (‘I spoke with Brendan Rodgers several times and he told me: “Stay another season, and you have my word if we don’t make it then I will personally make sure that you can leave.”’). It is circumstantial at the very best, at this stage.

    Anyhoo, even if there was said verbal promise, boo-hoo Luis(!) Should have got it down in writing.

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  58. Suarez and/or his agent misunderstood the terms of the contract and now they're unhappy about it. Of course they'll dispute it and argue for his right to leave but it's all bluster and nonsense. He won't leave this window unless a much larger bid comes from an team outside the PL very very soon. Suarez is entirely mis-representing the situation, claiming that he was given some assurance that he could go. What I suspect is he was told that if a big team came in for him and quickly (early in the window) and honestly (not cheekily only offering the base amount in the clause which should be confidential) offered to pay an agreed fee (something close to what Cavani was sold for) then Liverpool would likely let the transfer happen. Neither of those things have happened. Arsenal are the only team to make an offer and the amount they are willing to pay is not enough. Suarez is smart enough to know that, he's just doing everything he can to manipulate the situation and get what he wants. It won't work and right now his options are fast disappearing. Any bids from newly interested teams are now going to come in the last couple of weeks of the window, it's far too late.


    Suarez should feel foolish for everything he's said. No one has come to buy him, even though he believed he had some options. If Real or Bayern or anyone else are planning a last minute bid hoping to get him at a knock down price then that's not "in good faith" negotiations. Suarez has obviously had his agent talk with other teams, he should have gotten them to make a clear bid early in the window for a substantial amount. It didn't happen, so sorry Luis, you don't get to demand to leave for a direct rival for the minimum amount in the clause. I wonder if he's grossly over-estimated his worth as a player. Currently serving a suspension and with a hot-head that constantly gets him in trouble ... maybe Liverpool are the only team that truly value what he gives on the field. Even Arsenal are not willing to go over 40 million. If that's the case then bad luck.

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  59. Thats the odd part really. Clearly he rates himself, with good reason, so how does he balance the fact that no top teams came in for him, or even made a bid, against what he thinks he is worth. Even his agents brother didnt bother. So what are the chances he uses this time to think about his behavior and how it might of affected his standing in the world game ? None... absolutely no chance whatsoever. Compare this to someone like IBRA who is clearly a "strong" character who moves frequently and has had some problems. There is a top player who has his issues but has played at some of the top clubs in the world. So maybe your right maybe he just plain overrates himself. I hope he actually does think about this whilst he trains on his own.

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  60. At the end of the day, it boils down to what is written into the contract. Period. And it clearly does not state that Suarez could leave unconditionally. The price must be right. Verbal agreement cannot be legally binding unless it is recorded. Otherwise, it is your word against mine and how do you proof that.


    The press sensationalized the issue by printing that Suarez called Rodgers a liar. Suarez did not mention Rodgers but Liverpool and he accused them of broken promises. The press should just report it as it is and not use the term "lying". The press is very mischievous here. And Rodgers was not lying to Suarez. In any case, I don't Rodgers would be that stupid to commit selling him at 40m because he could not have known the market condition 1 year down the road. Rather, I believe Suarez twisted his words to suit his own needs to leave.


    Suarez and his agent is stupid and naive to believe he can leave for 40m + 1 pound. I'm sure Liverpool would allow him to leave if the price is right. After all, modern football is a business and money talks most of the time. Gareth Bale was not supposed to be on sale by Spurs but at 100m, how can they resist.


    Suarez can only blame the miserly Arsenal for trying to buy on the cheap and amazingly, there are no other clubs bidding for him. They know he carries a lot of negative baggage with him and probably don't think it worth while to have him no matter how good he is. He gets himself banned most of the time and seems to be a liar himself.


    I used to be a big fan of his but I have lost all respect for him with the way he treats the club and his disrespectful ways to get what he wants.

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  61. I get Suarez's frustration in not making the champions league. I am sure several million of us feel exactly the same way. Still, the way he has worked the issue publicly is shameful. He has done dome dumb ass things on the field that makes him look like he's 15 years old. As much as I or admire his considerable skills, he immature and will be a huge liability for us t bid going forward. Every missed shot over or wide will have us all wondering is he throwing the game or just not playing fully committed. As sad as it makes me, we need to sell him but only when we get a decent bid from outside of England. After all, we don't want him to suffering at the hands of the English press anymore. If we have to sit his immature, pouty butt until January, so be it. Get the best experienced striker we can and collect the cash in January if that the timing it has to be.

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  62. I think he's just immensely frustrated. He can't be so stupid as to not understand the wording of his own contract and the notion that Liverpool are not going to sell him for a minimum price to Arsenal. I don't even really believe he's that desperate to play for Arsenal. I think he's just being stubborn and is frustrated that:
    a - he's not understood his own contract and now looks like an idiot
    b - LFC are not even entertaining the bid from Arsenal despite the clause saying they would
    c - no one else is coming in for him


    I kind of understand where he's coming from, but I have little sympathy and what I would guess he's doing now is being deliberately ignorant of the reality of his situation. He's arguing about broken promises when it's really quite easy to understand why he's not leaving the club. Liverpool are not making it easy for him but if he really expected they would happily sell him to Arsenal for 40 million pounds then he's a moron. I don't believe that's true, I think now he's just being an ass.

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  63. So, like I said nothing was debunked, who you choose to believe has nothing to do with proof

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  64. Suarez renegotiated his contract since those alleged discussions a year ago anyway, when it was pretty obvious that we weren't going to qualify for the Champions League.


    Suarez is chatting a pile of sh!t and there IS clear evidence of his deceitful nature anyway. All we have to do is look back a few weeks into the original justification he gave for wanting to leave, when he thought that Madrid was a viable option for his departure.

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  65. I've defended Suarez's actions in the world cup as something instinctive and natural.


    I haven't defended his actions in the Evra incident, but stated I understood his reasons for not apologizing, since he believed he'd done no wrong.


    I totally understand his reasons for wanting to move onto pastures anew, rather than wasting another year of his peak at LFC while he thinks we are unlikely to achieve anything of substance.


    However, I totally disagree with him trying to force a transfer against the club's wishes months after he chose to sign a new contract, and I totally disagree with him disrespecting the club so often and openly with his contradictory comments.


    I still acknowledge that Suarez is a world class player and would argue that he is the best attacking player in the PL imo, and I do worry about the powers that be @ LFC's likely failure to replace him adequately, but Suarez has done enough damage to the name of LFC already. It's time to move on ASAP.

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  66. Yeah cant help but feel he has painted himself into a corner now. I think he really thought Madrid or Bayern would come straight in for him but when Arsenal were the only ones he just went ahead and took that.

    Tevez was worse and Mancini didnt appear to handle that too well but it kind of worked out alright for Man City. But I have a feeling we wont just let him kick and cry his way out of his tantrum so lets see what happens next but please lord make it end soon.

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  67. eriksen,Costa,Masch,Papa,Siqueira!!! SM,GJ,KP,DA,GS,JM,SG,CE,PC,DS,DC!! FB,IA,JA,JH,BJ,RS,KT 10+22+24+16+5=77-55 = 22 - 5 = 17 - 3 = 14

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  68. were in a pickle here i said yesterday we cannot sell him now as john henry would lose all credability (only to be shot down )well carragher as said this morning lfc would look stupid now if they sold suarez, i doubt suarez is going to say sorry (and if rodgers did say that why would or should he )so we are in limbo either way great summer we have reaaly pushed on,another wasted season ahead me thinks

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  69. I totally agree with the last part of your comment but I think it's right that the club will not allow itself to be bullied into selling him. For me the line was crossed when his representatives or Suarez himself told Arsenal how much to bid to trigger, what they thought was, his release clause. They effectively tried to scam Liverpool out of the chance to get as high a price as possible for him which just disgusts me. I don't think Suarez owes us anything for supporting him because that's what every single supporter of this club should have done. You don't support to get back, you support to give. I do believe however that we are entitled to get the price we want for him if we do sell. Him trying to scam us is deplorable and he will now have to bleed for it. He's under contract with us until 2017 so Liverpool can effectively finish his career if he doesn't start behaving. He would be 30 by the time his contract ends and if we keep him on the bench until then he can forget about a big money move elsewhere after that. If his advisors are worth only a bit of the money they cost they will tell him to publish an apology and get his mind back on playing so they can keep negotiations going in the background and he doesn't lose his value and attraction to other clubs. Just don't believe a word of it when his apology pops up on the .com site though because it will only be there to achieve his ultimate goal and that is to leave the club.

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  70. thats if he even issues an apolgy ,and we are not goining to leave him to rot if this summer as taught us anything ,its that we do not have a pot to p1ss in

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  71. and if you can show persuasive evidence that suarez is lying so am i ,but you cannot ,the only people who reaaly know are both saying different things ,do i believe suarez not really ,do i believe rodgers not really,from what i have seen of rodgers he likes to big himself up and comes out with things before he thinks them through ,he could may well have said it ,not realising the long term consiquences ,and obviously if he has hes overstepped the mark ,and knows it ,its funny how rodgers stance on suarez suddenly changed ,after suarezs latest outburst ,that implemented him,before that is out bursts were ignored by the club ,also why have the club not fined suarez ,its the standard practise ,or do they know the pfa would be involved ,and are trying to keep a lid on things

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  72. I bought my son a complete home kit with suarez name and number. What a waste of money. Had to listen to rubbish at his football training after the biding incident and told my kid that he was still an excellent player in spite of. Don't care if he is a world class player. Let him rot in the reserves and sell him abroad next summer. Let this be a, lesson to him and a statement from LFC. Unrealistic i know but the right thing to do.

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  73. Probably made a rod for their own backs to some extent as after years of complaints about Arsene's frugality they need to show they're serious and will spend now that they have the money. I don't really blame them at all, I blame LS, he's obviously given them real encouragement. Let's see who blinks first.

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  74. the thing is m8 hes on 140 grand a week thats a lot of money going down the pan coupled with his price depreciation..you could be looking at losing anything from 10 to 40 million when you see we could buy players of the quality benteke and erikson for that money its a massive dilema...id sell him to arsenal for 50m you just cant turn that kind of money away ,,,the problem is we cant now as it will make henry look weak ...also why would real bid big if they know we wont sell to arsenal the whole affair is a shambles

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  75. ill be amazed if suarez apologies ...roy evens cant understand why rogers has said that if he wants to move forward.....liverpool cant get it right they either say of do to little or they say to much

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  76. Downing off to West Ham it looks like. Thanks West Ham and kudos to Downing for the effort last season. Hope we get some players in, otherwise its a streamlined squad, which wouldn't be all that surprising as we aren't playing in Europe this season.

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  77. Yes, but what LS doesn't know is that John Henry is very good friends with the Dalai Lama, due to his friendship with Richard Gere & according to my source the DL is not too pleased about the biting incident....& is considering reincarnating LS as a rat instead of a gooner....


    I actually think its a very compassionate gesture myself, i mean who would want to be re born a gooner...? :-)

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  78. Like yourself I commend his efforts and turn around, it's a shame he couldn't completely do it like Henderson did because it's better for a transfer to work out in the end than to cut our losses.


    Having said that though, at the end of the day Downing wasn't good enough for us. It's concerning though, because we have lost experience and it doesn't seem like anyone is going to replace him. I don't know what Suarez will do, and Borini out wide is not good enough for me. Sterling and Alberto won't cut it as first choice players right now either.

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  79. our rodgers is not to astute imo says things then regrets them later

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  80. After what Rodgers has said about playing Coutihno centrally we can give up on the hope of getting Eriksen. Personally I'm really disappointed,really hoped we'd sign him but that's the way the cookie crumbles :/

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  81. If I'm not mistaken he said specifically to Arsenal wasn't it? (I'm may be wrong there and making what I'm about to say pointless). He didn't rule out a move,just to Arsenal.I still believe he'll probably end up at Madrid.Either way this saga is far from over.

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  82. Downing didn't turn it around Like Hendo because he doesn't have the mental resolve to do so.He needs to be told he's great or he'll cave in,at Liverpool you can't be like that,nor any big club.Downing is a mid-table player,not necessarily because of ability,more his mental ability (it being weak).I'd say he'll do pretty well for West Ham.So then....there's £35m wasted.Thanks again Kenny.(Always a legend no doubt but still)

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  83. I don't understand why Suarez would even apologise for anything at this point. He doesn't want to play for Liverpool and he can not play for Liverpool until after the window closes (by which point he hopes to be gone) - so demanding that he apologise to ingratiate himself with the manager/teammates/fans before he can get back into the team, doesn't really make any sense since he's hoping to never play for the club again anyway.


    Have I misread this somehow??

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  84. :-) ...thanks for tip... I'll nip down the bookies as they seem to take a bet on anything these days.

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  85. Well if he didn't hit the woodwork about 10 times in his debut season things may have been different. All ifs and buts though.


    I agree with you, Downing has the ability to take fullbacks on but never the mentality. I think he will be a success at the Hammers.


    I still want an experienced replacement, not happy with Sterling/Borini/Alberto as first choice.

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  86. Rodgers said .... ok, I know, Rodgers says a lot of things, but I hope this one is right ... he said that we're still looking for more quality players AND that we need wide players to allow Coutinho to play a true #10 role. He also specifically mentioned that left side attacking player - I do pray that we get such a player because we need one. A quality left attacking midfielder who can create and score goals and not need a season to adjust. Won't be cheap, but with Downing now gone I can't imagine we'll end up with no one.

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  87. but arsenal are the only club to bid...itf there are only arsenal and madirid interested why would madrid bid silly money ..if i was at madrid id put an offer in for 15m to upset the apllecart

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  88. id like to think they have a player to bring in ...for all his faults downing put a shift in last year

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  89. Yep, Sterling isn't ready yet. Too many blind alleys he goes down, at the cost of the team's build up phase. What Downing provided last season was balance. I think that is where the likes of Assaidi and Sterling have shortcomings. So we need balance and the wing penetration that fits in within the team style. Downing offered both but the latter was not to a good enough level, not even close. Good that he has moved on but we do need someone coming in, unless Sterling & co pull something out of the bag.

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  90. if we are relying on sterling to cover for downing i fear for not only for the team but also the player...he burnt out last year and another court date isnt going to help

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  91. Aye, I'm not even sure about him as cover for a first XI winger, let alone being in the first XI, currently. He needs to sort himself out, on and off the pitch.

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  92. downing is a good buy for 5 million.....and for all his faults served the team well last year ...no drama ..no headlines...and put game time in...at times sturridge looked as good as messi last year but hes just to injury prone

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  93. Imagine our happy surprise if/when Rodgers brings in some quality left attacking player who instantly slots into the team formation and give us that edge in the final third. We seriously need that. Lock up the deal this evening, medical on Wednesday, he can start on the bench against Stoke.

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  94. I think had we paid 5 million for him his form would never have been an issue. Even as poor as he was at times, he was never completely useless.

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  95. who is out there though ..the only quality winger we have been linked with is the kid from bayern on loan...

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  96. I actually want Coutinho to stay on the left. I prefer someone defensively capable in the middle like Hendo or Gerrard. Given that Assaidi is a natural left winger and he hasn't been moved on yet, I'd like to see a preferred right winger signed instead. You say left, I say right, probably doesn't matter as you would expect an attacker nowadays to be versatile enough to play on either side - But Coutinho has been great on the left, and unfortunately Coutinho in the number 10 means an unbalanced and possibly defensively unstable team with only Gerrard + Lucas in the midfield.

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  97. heres my point...he was that bad he played most games? ergo the other players are not as good as him...so who is replacing him ...sterling ...

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  98. Yeah exactly, his price and wage don't justify his contribution but he is better than Sterling at the moment. It's not like we are Pompey, we could keep Downing for 1 more season.

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  99. hes going to play tino in the middle 3...the problem with that is it means lucas and gerrad have to cover * not ideal * it also means he must be dropping allen and hendo to the bench ,,,which in turn means he must have some world class wingers to bring in ..if he doesnt bring these players in the plan falls at the first hurdle...even more so if suarez doesnt play

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  100. Fair shout because if Coutinho is out wide that means one of Allen or Henderson must play and that only leaves 1 other central midfielder in the entire squad available.


    I don't think it's going to work out.

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  101. kenny didnt set the price though...he identified players he wanted and commoli and co negitiated

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  102. Not a proper winger but is versatile and cheap (contract ends next season), I talk of Ljajic. Rate him for the way he won over the Viola fans and got his head down, after that incident. In a way, that sub incident could be the making of him. Looks like he is probably going to Milan though. Pity.


    I'm a fan of Griezzmann but I don't see him leaving Real Sociedad, a side that is in CL, and would cost quite a bit I reckon. One of the few players that is left footed, likes to play on the left wing, instead of cutting in from the right, but is still able to cut in from the left wing too to penetrate inside.

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  103. It is in his best interest to play out of his skin. If he doesn't, he will be benched and interested clubs will move on. Some may already have doubts whether he's more trouble than he's worth so all he can do to get his move is to be on his best behaviour. Uruguay are five points behind with six games to play and a game in hand to qualify for the world cup so it is by far not certain that Suarez will even get a chance to convince anyone next summer. The only opportunity to impress that he is certain of is at his club this season.

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  104. ive never thought it would work out but rogers has said tino is playing at 10...for tino to play at 10 IMO you need a big powerful mobile defensive player to cover behind who can stick to a rigid plan

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  105. the way we are shaping we will end up with steve guppy

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  106. Griezmann is a decent shout.



    Do you know of Andriy Yarmolenko? Any opinion?

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  107. No, not really, aside from his Euros 2012 showing.

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  108. I think he's pretty good. He can play up front or on the left, 23 years old. He also has a good goal record and possesses a decent set of skills for his size, I just looked him up now and I didn't realise he was 6 ft 2.


    You mentioned Griezmann and the names of a few left sided players popped into my head. There's still options out there we just need to act now.


    Who starts against Stoke?

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  109. In this day and age, I just can't fathom a manager having his head in the sand like that and if some still are oblivious like that, then they are naive. You can't just choose a player as a manager and not give a monkeys as to how much they will cost. Imagine manager says he wants player X, thinking that the club couldn't afford player Z, hence player X will do but the club spend a lot of money to get player X, which may have been enough to get player Z anyway. KK II has took responsibility for the signings, maybe not explicitly for the cost but I don't think he was out of the loop when it came to the financials behind those signings.


    Take Rafa. He used to allegedly aim for the likes of Villa, Dani Alves, Mata, etc, instead had to put up with a lower class of signings. He still moans about it to this day. He, like KK II, should or would have known the financial framework they are working within. So no, I don't pity Rafa or KK II in that regard, they should or would have known the financial limitations in relation to what players they can go for




    On the continent at some clubs, they have a committee (which can involve manager) or directer that is responsible for both identifying player and costs, which is different. Which is allegedly what we have now.

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  110. no you have read it right ,its just comical

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  111. Don't agree and even if that was the case,he'd have to approve of the....wait for it *35MILLLION POUND* Whether or not you want to acknowledge it Kenny had a part to play in it,a big one at that

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  112. @Jaimie K
    br is a liar
    br lied about carroll and reina
    rodger is a liar
    dont know if he is lying about this though

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  113. if we sign sequira and wilian what a team we have
    suarez?,sturridge,willian,coutinho,gerrard,lucas,johnson,sequira,toure,agger and mingelot

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  114. The denunking series are back! Totally agree with this article.
    The guy signed a long term contract last season, come on.
    Wonder if his performances will drop. We should fine him if he does not put enough effort in training.

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  115. If Madrid are to come in it'll be late as usual.The problem is it could be too late for us.

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  116. Suarez should have been sold at the beginning of the transfer market ....his antics are not helping at all and any serious minded club will never retain his services.........claiming LFC lied to you..and broken promises...if your girlfriend cheated on you.. will she have the nerve to ask you of the engagement ring u promised her..that F**l missed 20 games and his diving reputation made us miss certain game changing penalties ....perhaps we would have been in the champions league by now..f**l.

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  117. only Arsenal wanted to sign him m8

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  118. As far as I am concerned, I have stopped watching football years ago (after Jean-Marc Bosman and Lennart Johansson completely destroyed the game) - except for every LFC game, of course which is my weekly fix :)


    Many people were concerned about how a bad example the Suarez bite was for kids. But as an ex-coach of youngsters (6-8 years old), I am far more concerned by the bad example set by those divas who jump ships before it even began to sink.


    No Mr. Suarez you haven't deserved to play in the "Champion's" league. You have finished 7th in the League. You deserve to play in the "Champion's" League when you finish 4th (<--- what a paradox!) or better!


    Grow a pair, fight with your team to achieve success - THAT's what football and sport is about!!!


    Damn I miss football!

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  119. If this does go to court, on the balance, Suarez would probably win.
    First, there was obviously discussion about him leaving if liverpool did not achieve Champions League, otherwise why would there be such a clause?
    The clause itself is the context, why put a $$ figure attached to it, with a non-guarantee? While people are asserting that this is a low number, consider the fact that 40m is almost double what Liverpool paid only 1.5 years earlier.
    It might not be ironclad, but it proves the discussion took place that he would like to be allowed to leave if this objective was not reached, to the point that wording reflecting this desire was indeed included in his contract -and should serve as a promise. If the clause is poorly written, or written in such an ambigious way so as to serve the owners, it does not negate the intent.
    If, as the owners argue it is not binding, why even include it? If all liverpool are supposed to do is consider it, and act in "good faith", then there would be no point in its inclusion, as this would not differ from any other situation where an offer was received. It's inclusion, with certain conditions to be met (which have been) suggests that it was put there to give the player the option to leave - FSG are arguing that it is there to provide the illusion that he can go - essentially admitting that it was there to dupe the player.
    FSG are not acting in good faith here.
    When you combine this with the fact that Henry is saying "we told suarez and his agent that if a transfer were to happen, it would have to happen early in the transfer window." Again, is aknowledging the player's intent to leave, and their "willingness" to let this happen.
    Now they are backtracking, realizing that perhaps in today's market, $40m is less than what they could expect for the player and don't like the possible destination, and are hiding behind ambiguous words as their defence - quite simply they are acting in bad faith, as they know that delaying the matter, or letting it go to court will essentially thwart efforts to go.
    But, I guess people are happy that the big business with the sharks is getting its way - for now. Yay Lawyers!
    If they were acting in good faith, wouldn't they have targets to replace Suarez lined up? Does this mean that they missed out on some replacements? They didn't even try.
    I get how fans are pissed at Suarez, but in this istance the club are the one's at fault - who are not acting in good faith. More troubling for the fans though, is they are not making a real push for anything - they are hoping their moneyball philosophy pays off - 40m for suarez at the time seemed like a great pay-off, they underestimated, and want to reneg.

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  120. You seem to be a little confused here... the contract is just that, a contract...it is what you sign up to....LS is on very shaky ground if he claims "Oh but I thought it was something different" ...it just doesn't work like that. He'll have had his agent etc. go through it and then he signed it, if they have messed up it is on them not LFC. Nor does It prove what you claim, yes it shows there was a discussion but on what grounds is the critical question? The contract is the hard evidence of the terms of the discussion, if they claim it wasn't then why sign it? They could try and claim they were hoodwinked I suppose but that is going to be very hard to pursue, and stupidity in signing a clause they thought was something else is no defence.
    What Henry said re. if it happens it has to happen early is irrelevant, it only shows that LFC are willing to let him go under their terms, not his, which is what the non-existent clause would basically have allowed. Given that the PFA have looked at it and agreed with LFC on this I doubt very much that Suarez would win as you claim.

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