Liverpool manager Brendan Rodgers has left Daniel Sturridge on the bench for this afternoon's game with Manchester United, but the major surprise is the return of Fabio Borini, who is named amongst the substitutes.
FULL TEAM: Reina, Wisdom, Johnson, Agger, Skrtel, Lucas, Gerrard, Allen, Downing, Sterling, Suarez.
SUBS: Jones, Carragher, Henderson, Sturridge, Borini, Shelvey, Robinson.
Liverpool legend Jan Molby believes the Reds have nothing to fear at Old Trafford today.
Predicting the the Reds will dominate possession, the Dane told The Liverpool Echo:
"There are weaknesses we can exploit. Liverpool will get chances on Sunday and we might be able to dominate possession.
"United are wishy-washy in midfield, and I expect to see Joe Allen and Lucas Leiva alongside Steven Gerrard in midfield to help us get that control.
"If we’re going to get a positive result then we have to keep Van Persie quiet. That’s going to be hard because he’s in fantastic form. You can’t take your eye off him for a second".
Mark Lawrenson, however, predicts a 2-1 Man United win:
"You have to remember the Reds have not beaten anyone above them in the league this season, so it is probably Brendan Rodgers's most difficult game since he took over.
"That's why I would lean towards United. They are running away with the league at the moment and look full of confidence at home".
Jaimie Kanwar
FULL TEAM: Reina, Wisdom, Johnson, Agger, Skrtel, Lucas, Gerrard, Allen, Downing, Sterling, Suarez.
SUBS: Jones, Carragher, Henderson, Sturridge, Borini, Shelvey, Robinson.
Liverpool legend Jan Molby believes the Reds have nothing to fear at Old Trafford today.
Predicting the the Reds will dominate possession, the Dane told The Liverpool Echo:
"There are weaknesses we can exploit. Liverpool will get chances on Sunday and we might be able to dominate possession.
"United are wishy-washy in midfield, and I expect to see Joe Allen and Lucas Leiva alongside Steven Gerrard in midfield to help us get that control.
"If we’re going to get a positive result then we have to keep Van Persie quiet. That’s going to be hard because he’s in fantastic form. You can’t take your eye off him for a second".
Mark Lawrenson, however, predicts a 2-1 Man United win:
"You have to remember the Reds have not beaten anyone above them in the league this season, so it is probably Brendan Rodgers's most difficult game since he took over.
"That's why I would lean towards United. They are running away with the league at the moment and look full of confidence at home".
Jaimie Kanwar
best line up we could had.. sturidge should be pn the bench as he is the only one who can come in and make an impact
ReplyDeleteSturridge will most likely get a 30min run out on the wings as hes not 100% match fit, but putting him on to run at tired full backs cold be a stroke of genius
ReplyDeleteManchester United: De Gea, Rafael, Vidic, Ferdinand, Evra, Young, Carrick, Cleverley, Welbeck, Kagawa, Van Persie
ReplyDeleteTheir team never seems strong to me on paper. Vidic and Ferdinand are not what they were, and its the first time they've played together since september. Memories of Torres making vidic look stupid are coming back and I'd love to see suarez do that. You never know whos guna turn up in their midfield, Carrick is fairly solid but the rest can disappear. Obviously Van Persie can score from quarter chances, and Welbeck can be useful. But i think it will be tight with sturridge making an impact.
henderson should have started before allen ,hes a liabilerty to weak for matcheslike this can see him getting booked at the very least is tackling is shocking constantley gives free kicks away ,looks like i,ve blown my money rodgers could not pick his nose.backed gerrard for 1st goalscorer liverpool to win and scorecast 3/2
ReplyDeleteId have played hendo for allen ( hendos form is way better ) and sturridge for sterling or downing ( if your striker scores he should be an auto pick ) but hopefully rogers knows what he is doing...not sure what borini has done to warrant a place on the bench over assaidi or yesil
ReplyDeletewhy,s he dropped hendo ,allen will be the weak link today mark my words he will cost us big style,cannot understand rodgers logic why change a winning team allen hardley justified a recall after the mansfield game
ReplyDeleteYeah it's incredible how United continue to win games with such a weak looking (at lest on paper) midfield. I still can't get over the fact they won the league virtually playing with John O'Shea and Phil Neville in the middle of the midfield for a quarter of a season! Goes to show a lot of Pro games are 70-80% about mentality and being a real winner. We haven't had to many Mike Atherton type bloody minded players over the years. Hopefully that fight and 'nastiness' Suarez brings to the side rubs off on his team mates.
ReplyDeleteAssaidi is at the African Cup of Nations and to suggest having Yesil as an option in a match as big as this is ludicrous.
ReplyDeleteyoure right, allen didnt take control as i thought he would. we got dominated by a conference side and are now playing the top of the prem. but if allen plays in front of gerrard we could see him in a position we havnt yet, apart from the few minutes vs sunderland. he could turn out to be a good player there, offers more CAM threat than hendo imo. Suso on the bench would have been a good option, im disappointed hes not there. looked good vs united at home and vs chelsea
ReplyDeletees m8 but even then he came on when the game was over sorry but hes going to be rodgers big mistake today,hope he proves me wrong
ReplyDeleteAs much as I don't want to tempt fate my worry is not the Liverpool Players I think the team will make a good account of themselves.
ReplyDeleteMy concern is Referee and his ability to be neutral.
Watch Ashley Young try and dive and get free kicks off Wisdom & Johnson.
I'm concerned with Reina as well
The reason BR went with Allen over Henderson is that unlike Henderson, Allen doesn't panic when he's under pressure.
What has Borini done to be picked ahead of Assaidi today. Well, not being away for the African Nations Cup surely helped. And while Borini hasn't looked a world beater so far, Yesil has looked at least two years away from the first team.
ReplyDeletethe team is as strong as their weakest link, in this case our constant passing or Downing, maybe Allen
ReplyDeleteThe missus, who knows f all about football, said before the match that our opposition will score first and the first goal will come in the 19th minute.
ReplyDeleteIMO there is not a LFC player on the field who believes they can win this this match, not a single player is giving of the impression that this match is there to be won :(
ReplyDeletewhys it ludicrous to have yesil instead of borini....borini couldnt score when fit let alone coming back from injury...i could have used suso or other players the point is borini is garbage
ReplyDeleteOnce again rogers panders to his buddy allen at the expense of the team...Allen and lucas just doesn't work together ....and he drops the form midfielder hendo..........rogers is terrified of hendo or shelvey playing well against utd as it will mean he has to drop allen..........
ReplyDeleteI agree, they are weak but when 9 out of 10 game changing decisions go your way and your well protected by officials then you can get away with having a few weak players in your team lol
ReplyDeleteLooks like if were getting anything out of todays match its going to be down to Suarez again.
ReplyDeleteu should get her to tell you the lottery numbers. heck it's always worth a try I say
ReplyDeletegerrard and allen are just awfull, no surprise with allen.its losing us the game.
ReplyDeletelucas has been excellent
Lets see how her other predictions come off. If these are as accurate as the above one, I'll be a rich man this time next week. :-)
ReplyDeleteLucas is playing well I agree, but when are the rest of the team showing up?
ReplyDeletepls change it BR the 1st half was depressing viewing.
ReplyDeleteAllen is useless and overrated....with him in midfield we'll surely be outmuscled and outrun!
ReplyDeleteRodger's signings suck!
ReplyDeleteNo, the major surprise is that Allen started instead of Henderson when Henderson is clearly the better choice. Allen did nothing to get into the team. Henderson is the better option how can BR not see that? Ridiculous.
ReplyDeleteGerrard's has looked a lot better this season when he has started without Allen alongside him...
ReplyDeleteHenderson of late has been getting into the box and has been supporting attacks. Allen did nothing to deserve that starting place other than being Rodger's favourite. Sick of this nepotism.
ReplyDeleteWell northwest derby has clearly lost its meaning in last couple of years. neither team has "ignited", as if the fixture wasnt that important anymore. what we have seen has been halfhearted display from liverpool, and manU has been satsified to just pass the ball since RVP jogged (without being properly marked) inside our penalty box and just "put" the ball in.
ReplyDeleteit has been a boring game so far, and united has been superior and controlled midfield. pregame our midfield was supposed to be far better than opponents. why the hell are we not controlling the game then?
wonder if BR has the balls to bring on henderson to Allen. who has been horrible.
and id like to see Suarez drop to 10 position and sturridge brought in.
utterly dissappointed in our effort..... oh wait? what effort.
Got to bite my tongue after that first half but really disappointing. Tactically we've been completely out thought.
ReplyDeleteIts not hard to tactically out think someone who only has 1 tactic
ReplyDeleteFirst half has gone worse than I feared (performance wise) - I at least expected us to pressure the ball and dominate possession, but for some reason we're just dropping back and letting Man U do what they want.
ReplyDeleteSterling has not had a good game, Downing has been his usual anonymous self, Allen is not contributing anything in the final third (assuming that that role has been handed to him this game) and this has left Suarez battling against 5 defenders by himself, yet again.
The sooner Downing pi$$es off the better. Liverpool desperately need more matchwinners, and he will never be that guy.
Took Lucas off... Amazing! lol
ReplyDeletelucas off rodgers has lost the plot this turnip has got to go
ReplyDeleteI agree, I'm glad someone can see the game properly
ReplyDeleteThe aggressive defensive aspect of the game was something I was looking forward to seeing more than the patient passing under Rodgers' this season, as I feel that that is what so defines Barcelona's play above and beyond everybody else.
ReplyDeleteI guess Liverpool are just too slow on the whole atm to successfully implement such a style of play. Hopefully that's the reason that we're not seeing it so far atm anyway, and longer term we will see the team pressing all over the pitch just like at Barca (or even Benitez's best teams)
Allen, Downing, Sterling all anonymous, poor display. Young has got away with a 2 footed, both feet off the ground tackle on Agger without even a talking tojust because he was injured doing it. If that was Evans he would have been rolling around in agony...
ReplyDeleteno he just gives the ball away wether under pressure or not
ReplyDeleteYes, ridiculous decision. Should've been Allen.
ReplyDeleteYet another free kick in a dangerous position courtesy of Allen, such an inspired signing and pure quality I feel blessed to have watch him play for my club..
ReplyDeleteAgree. Sterling is having a nightmare. Take him off.
ReplyDeleteDon't understand how bad Allen has to be to be dropped
ReplyDeletei give up....Allen is worse than i thought....all those on here who say hes good need to wake up......rogers hasnt a clue im trying to give him a chance but to take lucas off and leave allen on is just pure BULLS*IT....get allen off hes garbage
ReplyDeleteI don't know why we are playing too defensively looking very scared ,and not pressing Utd and making Carrick and Cleverly like world class players. I have stated many times that Gerrard,Allen and Lucas should never start together yet there they are again.The British Xavi "ALLEN" ,Rodgers LOVE child will play on despite being very poor and Lucas is sacrificed .I just hope it does not backfire and add insult to injury .
ReplyDeleteWorried about him gettin sent off by webb m8
ReplyDeleteGet Allen off and we have a chance!! Well done Sturridge :)
ReplyDeletesorry i shouldn't have a go at allen as his role means he doesn't tackle or score goals...Ps dont want to sound like a no all but strikers who score should always start....now get allen off and we may have a chance
ReplyDeleteYep, makes sense.
ReplyDeleteGreat Job Sturridge! tha is what ive been talking about. but someone please tell me why is Sterling starter and why are we playing owning at all
ReplyDeleteLucas was possibly one foul away from a second yellow.
ReplyDeleteand rogers is one butty short of a picknick.......cant see allen getting booked as he hasnt got near a utd midfielder to kick one
ReplyDeleteHey guys could you imagine what it would feel like to be able to say, "Allen is terrible (I know we always say that, but wait..) get him off and get Sneidjer on".
ReplyDeleteObviously its just a dream lol
I like the look of Sturridge. He has supreme confidence on the ball, and that's great.
ReplyDeleteThis Sturridge lad in particular. I mean, who does he think he is. Two goals in two games. Poor, really.
ReplyDeleteAny chance you could find out if Rodgers is on here JK as every comment about allen been poor gets voted down lol
ReplyDeleteI think rogers has set his stall out in this game to the other midfielders that it doesn't matter how hard you train or how well you play Allens my man....it must be dispiriting to hendo shelvey coady and co to know this
ReplyDeleteallen off after 80mins contribution zero
ReplyDeleteNo but Rodgers got to see the man he loves make that zero contribution so he wont complain
ReplyDeleteI wonder what rogers will say about the game and point out how crap allen is.....i also wonder if hell explain why hendo didn't start
ReplyDeleteIt's obvious what Rodgers will see: "I thought we were outstanding. The effort and commitment of the players was terrific, and I couldn't ask any more from the them; they were amazing and fantastic, and Luis was absolutely outstanding, and Gerrard was amazing. We were just incredible"
ReplyDeleteFor all the those who see Joe Allen as a starter please watch this match again. Should have been on the subs bench. Henderson did better when he came on. Well done to sturridge, he and Suarez had some good link up play. Wisdom had a good game. not sure if Sterling is progressing. He seemed to run into dead ends. BR made a few tactical errors in the beginning [1st half].
ReplyDeleteWhat happened in halftime? it was like i watching two different games. first 45 mins it was nightmarish, we didnt play and united were just passing around. second 45 we did play and united couldnt cope.
ReplyDeleteBorini looked sharp, taking in concideration his injury and first game after it.
Sturridge was best player of liverpool
id like to see our front three consist Sturridge-Suarez-Borini.
i cant take anything away from united though, they showed again why they top the table. they took advantage of our lackluster display during first 45.
you need to play well full 90 minutes to take points in premier league, not to mention to take points in old trafford. i hope BR tells players that. though i worried it will be, we were fantastic for second 45, not we were horrible for first 45 in press conference.
webb did a good job.
i thought sturridge was superb for his first prem game he scored and could have scored more..two goals two games ...plus he links well with louis...wisdom was also outstanding...on a minus Allen was woeful.....if hes a 15m pound player ill eat my cap just what does he do....
ReplyDeleteStill think that Jason? they were hanging on for 20 mins
ReplyDeleteThere goes not losing with Wisdom in the team :P I'd like to see Robinson given a few chances in the near future because although Wisdom seems very strong defensively he's a bit weak going forward. Johnson is more comfortable on the right.
ReplyDeletei usually try and add a few smart alec comments jaimie but im really fuming at him starting allen ...i think if we had started with hendo and sturridge we would have won
ReplyDeleteI don't think Allen was *that* bad. Yes, he had a poor game overall, but he also played okay in patches.
ReplyDeleteAllen almost giften United a goal but Agger and Skrtel cleaned up the mess. He got better in the second half for sure but overall he was poor, probably the worst I've seen him play this season. The sad thing is I reckon if that was Downing, Suso or Henderson who had performed that badly for 45 minutes they would of been yanked off without question. It seems like double standards to me.
ReplyDeleteGotta say Sturridge looked really good when he came on. Nice goal, the kind we have lacked, so rarely this season have we had anyone running in to get re-bounds. I also thought he was our best player in the second half. Looked sharp, his touches were nice, and changed the game. Still not sure on Borini, but was nice to actually have some true attackers on the pitch.
ReplyDeleteGerrard is still the White Elephant in the room for me, he just looks lazy now, hardly makes any runs, and mis-places so many passes, Allen isn`t working that well either, but I still think that is down to who he has around him.
We still miss that great link between mid and attack.
I was impressed to see BR change it early to go for the win.
Also seemed to work ok.
ReplyDeletewe did not buy the British XAVI for 15M to play in patches did we Jaimie. He never got anywhere near the ball in the first half and we did not press them enough .
ReplyDeleteSturridge looked like he wanted too, also nice to see him tracking back, and not doing any celebration after goal, going against so many negatives people have been saying about him
ReplyDeleteDowning and Henderson have consistently played poorly since they arrived (until recently). Allen has been much more consistent that those two, and his bad games are few and far between; plus, he's been at the club for less than half the time. It's not double standard, it's being fair. If after 19 months Allen is performing badly, then he'll get the same reaction.
ReplyDeletetrue i keep saying the 3 of them should never start a game together for me its Lucas and Gerrard then Henderson Allen is 4th choice for me, that s looking at the last 6-8 games Allen has been very poor .
ReplyDeleteTurns out that they win with an offside goal- we've lost 4 points with incorrect offside goals and now lose two more with an offside goal against.
ReplyDeleteI hope Rodgers has learned his lesson now to use Allen less in highly combative games, he can't hack it yet, that Downing will contribute very little when we're not in the ascendancy, that we need a left back for cover as Johnson loses concentration regularly, and that Sterling should spend most of the rest of the season as an impact sub...
But most of all that if the team play like they did in the second half, attempting to dominate teams, and being positive rather than winning the stats match, that we will win more games overall, and fans will accept losses with a far lighter heart even though we will still hate it.
Over to you Brendan. This is your crossroads....
Did you see Johnson's wonderful defending Gilstrap for the second goal? Where were our CB's for the first?
ReplyDeleteInstead of criticising only Allen please go look at how shoddy our defenders were for both the goals that were conceded.
Lucas was one card away from a red and with him going off for Sturridge was a positive move as we actually got the ball going forward unlike the first half.
Terrible first half but much better in the second half. We lost, could have been by a lot of more goals but then again we had some good chances to either draw or win. Not happy with the result but as always the mancs have the last laugh just like they have for ab
Agreed, Sturridge looked class. Exactly what we have lacked for a while. I still don`t think Allen and Lucas and Gerrard work as a trio though. It makes it all too slow in the mid. Gerrard has lost all his pace now, or is being told to not run so much, and Allen and Lucas are to defensive. I think all our good players, just not in that team at the same time, it lacks creativity, pace and a link between mid and attack.
ReplyDeleteout 99% of the time over the last 22 years.
ReplyDeleteHow many times do you and jobsy have to say Allen shouldn't have started. We get it all ready! Do you really think the game was lost because of him? I think we would all agree hendo should have started but to be fair to Allen as bad as he was first half he was much better second half. We dominated the midfield second half largely because of a higher tempo and another option up front with sturridge, whose directness and pace pushed utd back so we played much further forward. If sturridge had been fit enough to play 90 mins we would probably have got a result. If people can't see the positives of the second half with sturridge and borini back (who has great movement and workrate) then they are overly critical considering where we are as a club at the moment
ReplyDeletepaid them too much respect first half, should have started with danny, we need a win against city or arsenal, results this weekend with other clubs near us not too bad but we need a win, what a weekend, my lfc loving cat died, ( r.i.p. shanty ) and now the mancs beat us, off to get p****d
ReplyDeleteAllen is ok, its having him gerrard and lucas on at the same time that is the problem. No pace, no flair. When we play with only two or one of them we have looked better. When we have played without Gerrard we have looked even better. We now have all the attackers we need I think, but so need a good AM, to replace gerrard and link us up more.
ReplyDeleteIt was level a best, and even if was offside would have been impossible to give as evra was blocking the view. your right about downing he needs to go. Johnson did look a bit suspect today.
ReplyDeleteJaimiei watched allen specifically as i didn't think his form warranted a start and he was dire...watch a re run of the game he contributed nothing
ReplyDeleteSturridge came on, and we broke up having three slow mids. Thats what happened.
ReplyDeleteGerrard awful, seriously? Even Gary Neville of all people recognises what he offers the team right now
ReplyDeleteyour kidding wisdom was excellent ...sure he ballooned a shot but at least he got into the position
ReplyDeleteGerrard. Er, only had the shot which lead to our goal. Get a clue.
ReplyDeleteAgreed Sturridge was great, which makes me smile after saying time and time again he will do well, for most (not all) other people on here to write how he was no good etc.
ReplyDeleteDowning did just perform that badly for 45 minutes...
ReplyDeleteSuso is the only player that consistently gets yanked at half time, regardless of how some of his teammates are performing...
Agreed, Gerrard was worse to me, mis-placed many passes and doesn`t run anymore. I wonder if this is on orders, or just time catching up with him. We need a new AM.
ReplyDeleteYep, Allen is the new lucas. He was played as a DM out of position, so did struggle a little, and know any game we loss everyone blames him and him only.
ReplyDeleteSpot on Jason, Allen lacks competitive toughness, gave away free kick after free kick, and gave away the ball who knows how many times.
ReplyDeleteSturridge is still re-gainning fitness. Use logic to work out why he didn`t start. I`m sure over the next few games you will get to see him start more.
ReplyDeleteforget about downing at least he contributed something ...what about the welsh xavi he contributed nothing.....and hasnt for some time ...if hes the future of our midfield we are in trouble because he doesn't show up in these types of games
ReplyDeleteI see a lot of people talking about Suarez as a no. 10, but this ignores the fact that he is a pretty poor passer of the ball.
ReplyDeleteA quality number 10 has to be composed in tight spaces and release perfectly weighted balls at the perfect time to open up opposition defences. Suarez regularly misplaces and under-hits his passes, or just holds onto the ball for too long.
imo he's a great no. 7, a very good no. 9 and would just be an average no. 10.
Good to see Rodgers' actively making changes asap, even if they didn't pay off in the end.
ReplyDeleteHopefully he will stop making the same mistakes from the start in the future...
Brilliant answer, which just goes to show how much other posters are so quick to jump on players and Br without even knowing the facts.
ReplyDeleteGerrad like allen doesnt need to worry about form or improving there game as they will be picked regardless...see if rogers points any of the blame at these two he will probably blame hendo ...rogers is a first degree coward who cant make the big decisions regarding big players....hes a mster of slight of hand blaming everything and everyone bar the problem in hand
ReplyDeleteHe is a 15m pound player, i would say eat your cap but its probably worth more than Joe allen at the moment!!
ReplyDeleteGet a clue? you serious? I`m guessing you never been on here before then?
ReplyDeleteAnd Yes Gerrard was poor, and has been all season. He had a shot which didn`t go in. That doesn`t really count as a assist. Unles you are suggesting that was his plan? To shoot in the aim of the keeper knocking it back out?
So next time you decide to be rude, and offensive to a poster, maybe think about what you are writing first.
pretty poor passer? he has given many Key passes during the season and today during first half he was one of our most accurate passers of the ball. if you want a poor passer check downing and sterling. both of our flanks arent cut for premierleague,
ReplyDeleteits a match thread and allen played in the match....its funny how its okay to blast some players constantly but not others...carroll is constantly brought up in threads and he doesnt even play at the club.....
ReplyDeletei believe the stat you are looking for is 21 games 0 assist 0 goals. And an unidentified midfield position ;-)
ReplyDeletewot the fuck is sterling all about .a reserve team player at best he was suposed to be markin evra . johnson who had a stinker never a left back.but thats not his fault .downing piss poor .a fuckin nightmare 45 mins .then brenda changes things .this tic tac crap has got to go and so has rodgers .what did mike bassett say 4 4 FUCKIN 2. bring back the KING
ReplyDeleteagreed 100%. gerrard has had the occasional good game this season. but to quote one of my all time favourite musicians. mr steven wilson in one of PT songs "time flies", and it has flown fo mr gerrard
ReplyDeletein football zanatos there are two options you attack and you defend ..which one is allen....because from what i see he does neither or is he so special he exonerated from attacking or defending...make up your mind he cant have it all ways
ReplyDeleteperhaps he should have been a seamstress because there good in patches
ReplyDeletePlease tell me what I am making up my mind on? You know full well that a DM roles is different from say Alsono`s role. Alsono wasn`t a defensive mid, nor a attacking mid, he was a creator, passer, just like Allen. So please explain why i need to make my mind up? As from my end im not confussed at all. There is lots of players who play the Ball playing Mid role, who aren`t attackers or defenders. I get you may not like that role, but lots of top world class managers seem too, so if you don`t mind I will side with them on this one.
ReplyDeleteI think Suarez is an inconsistent passer. A bit like Rooney.
ReplyDeleteHe can play lovely chips and crosses and even nice through balls now and again, but he has a habit of hitting sloppy passes (too hard/too slow etc.).
I personally would give Suarez a chance in the no.10 role and see if he can work it out but I definitely see where Jay is coming from.
But there is no point in even mentioning gerrad as hell never be dropped under Rogers....rogers just doesn't have the b*lls to do it
ReplyDeleteIf you choose to look at the stats gerrard is up there at the top of the league in nearly all the key areas (bar goals). Passes, key passes, assists, chances created, crosses etc. so he's not been poor at all. People only say that when they compare him to how he used to be, when he was at his best and in the top handful of players in the world. He's not that level anymore of course but according to the stats is still mixing it with the best in the league. Honestly don't see where this criticism is coming from, if he can't pass anymore or create chances how has opta got him so highly rated?
ReplyDeleteAlsono only scored 19 goals in 210 games for us. Not every player is just about goals.
ReplyDeleteI agree with this. Allen, Gerrard and Lucas are just static. Hendo isn't polished but I'd put him in for Allen for the time being because he is an instigator.
ReplyDeleteStats aren`t everything. How many games have we had high possesion stats, more shoots stats yet still lost?
ReplyDeleteYes Gerrards stats are still good. But I feel he isn`t up to it anymore, and with a different player in that role, we would score more, and create more.
The Criticism comes for watching the games, and watching him stood there static, and giving the ball away.
I`m not comparing him to his old self, but to what I expect from a player.
Lost to manu because of an inept manager.
ReplyDeleteAlonso was both zanatos he defended and attacked....or was scoring from your own half not attacking...creator zanatos hahah what has allen created in the 6 months here i cant recall anything ...well he nearly created a goal for utd today...please zanatos you seem like a knowledgeable guy so don't compare alonso to allen
ReplyDeleteHope everyone can now see that BR is a lousy manager who just talks like salesman with no results to show. Poor tactics and player selection cost this game dearly
ReplyDeleteyep, but people are too romantic about him, and if you say a bad word they don`t like it.
ReplyDeleteHe is still a good player, but maybe he should be moved back into Allens role, and us play a different person in the AM role.
suarez was so isolated upfront in the first half he had to do his own chasing after loose balls or come deep and out of position to receive ball. Everyone could also tell that Allen and Downing were poor. Why wasnt Sturridge and Shelvey playing in the first place?
ReplyDeleteI don't think Henderson has consistently played poorly, nor do I think Allen has consistently been better.
ReplyDeleteI think Henderson has largely been meh. Nothing. Not registering. Not to the extent that he terribly anonymous like Downing, but simply neither good nor bad. He definitely needs to do a lot more if he wants to play for Liverpool, but I just think that judgement is a little harsh.
Allen started brilliantly but for one reason or another, has regressed. I don't know if he has played with a knock, or if playing slightly out of position has disoriented him but he has dropped off a lot in my opinion. I don't think the lack of movement in our midfield helps him though. Sometimes he gets marooned on the ball, looking for an option while Gerrard and Lucas just watch.
Wouldnt have cared if we,d played cak today & won with a winner of webbs a**e
ReplyDeleteCome on now lads, I know we're disappointed, but can't we all just make an effort to remember that Brendan's surname has a 'd' in it?
ReplyDeleteI`m comparing positions not players. Alsono only scored 19 goals in 210 games. That really isn`t a attacking mid is it? Allen has actually done passes which went to players who then set up the assist. Allen does tackle, so maybe he is also both??? Allen had the most tackles and interceptions for any mid player up to dec (aint seen the stats since). Stats aren`t everything, but I do think some people are just hating on Allen without looking at it correctly. Allen isn`t my fav player, but I don`t think he is that bad, just those three don`t work when played together, which makes him look worse.
ReplyDeleteAnd hardly anyone on here dares to blame him lol
ReplyDeleteokay but he scored 15 in 143 league appearances, i make that at least one goal every 9.5 games. If JA is more comparable too Xavi than this season 18 games 5 goals 4 assists. I want him to do well but i just need to know what value he adds to the team for 15m.
ReplyDelete100 % not only do we have to battle against Manu now but our managers very poor team selection
ReplyDeleteAgreed
ReplyDeleteAllen doent panic under pressure ...which game were u watching ...he was our worst player by miles and almost gave a goal away with his panic back pass ...Old wiskeyNose must have done a jig when he saw allens name on the team sheet
ReplyDeleteReplies show it was offside, not level. However I don`t think that should be used as a excuse. We lost, and offsides are always iffy, I still don`t understand how a linesman is mean`t to be able to look in two places at once, and now with the change of rules, also be looking at who might affect play. In real time, it must be a nightmare to get right every time, these things just happen.
ReplyDeleteMy view is that we don`t play the right mix of mids. Allen is a good player, Lucas is, Gerrard can be, but never at the same time. When we let Allen have a more advanced role one game he looked very very good. Play Lucas Hendo Gerrard, or Allen Gerrard Shelvey or Lucas Hendo Shelvey, etc just never Lucas Allen Gerrard. Too slow.
ReplyDeleteagree, and it wasn't against the run of play. At real time thats impossible to give, even though we were playing manure.
ReplyDeleteWow jaimie ...Spot on ...We Finally agree on something ...
ReplyDeletefair point, well presented.
ReplyDeleteZanatos, I think it is clear that is very little form of logic on this site especially saying things like why does Borini get selected ahead of Assaidi...
ReplyDeleteYou say stats aren't everything but they give an indication of what a player is doing, surely you must agree with that? And if the stats say he's one of the best in the league at what he does then how can that be criticised? You reference the fact that the teams stats are good but we are still losing, to prove your point, but you are quoting the (almost) meaningless ones, such as pass completion and shots. Pass completion means little if the ball isn't used properly and you can have a 100 shots but if they are all off target your not gonna score. The difference with Gerrards stats is they are important, key passes, assists, chances created (as I've already said). That means they are relevant because he is being creative. You say if we had someone else there we would create more ad score more but there are only a couple of players in the league who are doing more than him so that's an unfair criticism. The fact is gerrard has more assists, more key passes and more crosses than any utd player this season whilst having the second highest number of passes, and united is running away with the title so for gerrard to do that shows he's not our problem for sure
ReplyDeleteI have to agree with you here. Hearts above minds, which is a nice thing, but can give unfair criticisum to people. If I`m correct BR is know being blamed for not starting a player who isn`t in the country lol. BR has and does make mistakes, and there is a few things he does I openly will state I don`t like, but I wont just have a go at him for stuff he has no control over. That is when reason gets lost, and hatred sets in, and that aint me.
ReplyDeletewot the fu2k is this sterling about he was pickin up evra then let him go he is at best a resi player. allen downing piss poor . johnson also had a mare but hes no left back .this brings me to brenda he picks the team the buck stops with him.he aint up to it.90 mins a game lasts .not 45.that ist half was fu2kin shockin.what did mike bassett say 4 4 fuckin 2! time for a cruise kenny!!!
ReplyDeleteI still dis-agree. I will give you that stats do count, and can help us see things differently, but from watching games I just feel he isn`t doing enough. No stats will change that other than goals. Allens stats showed he was the third best Ball playing mid in the world last year. (might have been fourth) Yet every football fan can tell you from watching him, that isn`t the case (not having a go at him as i like him, just a example).
ReplyDeleteThere is no such thing as wrong stats. I used possesion and shoots as that was just two I picked out from my head. If you are to use stats and stats only, they all count.
I have seen almost every game this season, and in many games Gerrard hasn`t been up to it, do your stats show amount of chances ruinned? if so what does this come under? Do they show speed of his play? Hold up work?
I put it to you, that due to our style, the AM should have better stats than our current one does. That our current AM (Gerrard) is one of the reasons we haven`t scored more goals.
BR lost major points today poor starting eleven POOR allen was HORRIBLE downing was a GHOST come on BR shelvey or henderson on and sturridge should have started play the first 45 intensely then change in the second half but irregardloess we should have taken the game to them in the first 45 poor really poor today but blame goes to BR this game was to big for allen and downing sigh three points lost 9 points from top four
ReplyDeleteYou have hit the nail on the head. Hatred is a terrible thing and in the end leads to stupidity :-)
ReplyDeleteExactly CN. Its tiring rewriting Gerrard's strengths over and over again. I see a lot of people on here who just begin lambasting and generalising about a player's form and it very much seems like they are taking out their frustrations without being objective.
ReplyDeleteZanatos, i am passing comment on your comment; its up to you how you interpret that. Gerrard has not been 'poor all season'. I find that ridiculously over the top; therefore 'get a clue'. And, yes i watch all the games as well. And, yes i do check this site regularly.
Lost a Game before the ball was even kicked and yet I felt we truely had a chance to beat Man U today . Man U's weak link is thier soft Mid and weak defense ...they shipping in goals for fun this season and the only reason they on top is becuase of their amazing attacking line and ( even though I hate his guts ) an amazing tactical manager " ol Wiskey Nose " .... .
ReplyDeleteThat said this was the team i had before the match which i believed could exploit man U's weak mid and defense ....
Pepe Reina , Johnson RB , Skrytl , agger , Downing LB ....
Lucas Defensive Mid , Hendo Pressing and chasing the Ball and Gerrard as our forward attacking mid supplying Saurez and co
, sterling wing , Saurez wing and Sturrige centre ......
The moment i saw allens name on the team sheet i knew we lost .... KNEW IT ...that pathetic feeling knowing that before a match against utd our manager basically hands them the victory ....
BR is basically Tactically inept and also soo inexperianced that he has to use allen cuz he forked out 15 Mill for him and the hope allen has a semi decent game for us .....The simple reason that we lost to man U today >>>> BRENDON ROGERS out of dept for a team like Liverpool and thats a FACT ...even preforming bad with KK ment we beat Man U , arsnel , Chelsea and Man City last year FACT as well , people also talk about KKs poor signings lets look at Rogers 15 allen , 10 Borini , 5 for Sahins loan , 2 assidi and now 12 sturrige ..Thats 44 MILL with only Strudgge looking a decent buy and he even stuffed that up cuz we could have had Sturrige from the beginning of the season but he dragged his feet for a loan deal and then signs him in jan .....
Poor poor manager whos only gift is his carsalesman talks and his being a media darling ....he WILL bring us down and today was YET another example ....
Dis-agree I think Gerrard has been poor all season. weather you find it ridiculously over the top or not, that is my view on him this season, which I think is correct. If you have ever read any of my posts, you would see I am very objective, of which I`m sure many other posters could confirm.
ReplyDeleteAnd telling some one to "get a clue" is offensive, so please re-frain from doing so, I am mature enough to dis-agree with you, without sniping at you, If you can`t do the same, that is a reflection of yourself not me.
But what are you disagreeing with? You say stats count (and quote some in a response to someone else further down the page) but then say he isn't doing enough. If he's at the top in all those creative stats (bar goals) what else can you expect? Some stats can be interpreted in different ways as j have already said and yet again you choose an irrelevant one to make your point, regarding joe Allen last season but all that stat is -is pass completion. Essentially meaningless. Some stats are fact, such as goals, assists, key passes (as determined by the experts at opta) crosses etc. They are fact wether you acknowledge them or not. And gerrard is at the top of the league in all bar goals. That is a fact that cannot be interpreted differently. You say he's ruined chances but all players are guilty of that and the fact is hes better than most at creating them so that's an unfair criticism. And if you watch us so closely surely you'd know gerrard isn't playing as our AM in most games, he is playing deeper. Shelvey and even hendo have played further forward than him when they play in the same team, it's only when Allen is in there with him and Lucas gerrard will get further forward. Who else would you have ahead of him in the current squad?
ReplyDeleteI expect Goals. That is what else. He isnt at the top either, he is near the top. I dis-agree with your view on Gerrard, I thought that was clear? So let me get this straight, any stats I pick is irrevelant, but ones you pick aren`t? surely they are all just a matter of point of view? Or have I missed the list that shows a order of importance for stats?
ReplyDeleteJoe Allens Pass-Completion is also a Fact, and not irrelevant IMO.
Gerrard isnt top of the league in all stats other than goals, that simply isn`t true, so please stop saying FACT all the time.
As you will notice, I said we should get a new AM, so I thought it should be clear, I don`t want anyone ahead of him ideally, but If you are trying to force a point, then I would play Shelvey ahead of him.
joe allen jay spearing 15 mill diference dont think so .keep js and sell allen
ReplyDeletebut he wont zanatos thats why rogers is a poor manager....he just keeps playing lucas allen and gerrad together and everyone except him knows it doesn't work and never will...lucas and allen should never play together
ReplyDeleteam on the patches to kick the cigs should have put them over my fu3kin eyes so i didnt have to watch him
ReplyDeleteThat bit I do agree with, but only when it includes Gerrard. Second game Lucas was back, Allen got pushed up more, and looked really good. So I don`t think the problem is just having them two, but when you have them three. If you had Lucas, Hendo then Allen I think that could work, although I don`t think for one min Allen is ever going to be a great AM lol.
ReplyDeleteWell you get my vote CN. It seems Zanatos has formed his opinion based on how it appears to him/her. I can think of some killer passes Gerrard has pulled off - to Suarez in particular. I would say with would elevate him to be better than 'poor all season' but if like a dog with a bone you want to persist, go ahead.
ReplyDeletei agree billy ...id sell allen and keep spearing as cover the problem is we would only get about 5m for him max FOR ALLEN....hes vastly overated
ReplyDeletehe adds none.....lucas henderson and shelvey should all start before him ...they wont though because he rogers golden boy....Charlie adam was miles better....he put his foot in and at least set up the odd goal
ReplyDeleterogers is acting as though we won.....his interviews really wind me up....i feel like shaking him and saying they beat us thats the idea of the game to score more...if we had deserved more we would have got more
ReplyDeleteSo you at least acknowledge he is near the top of these stats (and actually is the top in several)? Thats progress at least. Your entitled to your opinion but for it to be valid it has to be backed up. I'm backing mine up with the stats which are unequivocal, you are not. 'Because Zanatos thinks so' isnt a valid reason to back your opinion when it goes against the facts that youve alreay acknowledged. Joe allens pass completion stat is a fact too but surely you can see the difference between a stat showing a 90% pass completion against the most number of assists in the league for instance? Or one of the highest number of key passes? Or chances created? So yes the stats you have picked are irrelevant when they don't have a measurable impact on the team as Gerrards does! Surely that's common sense? And once again he isn't playing as the AM so I agree I'd like to bring someone else in but if your trying to say shelvey has contributed more than gerrard this season, so should take his place, just goes to show your bias against him. I wonder who our opposition would prefer to play against lol
ReplyDeleteI'd also ask what you use to judge a midfielders performance/contribution then if not these stats? Just goals? Nothing else?
ReplyDeletelooks like we will cuttin our losses again to get rid
ReplyDeleteCheers Tom. Like you it annoys me that people can form these opinions and spout off about it (as many do) without basing it on any facts. No body is perfect and we would all like to see gerrard score more goals, he's acknowledged himself he should score more, but it is ridiculous to say he's been poor all season. But all you get back is 'I'm entitled to my opinion', as if it makes it correct! Well it's my opinion the Earth is flat and the moon is made of cheese ;0) Don't think the facts back it up though
ReplyDeletesince when has the Opta, statistics become the highest and the only authority regarding player performances? when you say Gerrard has been one of our best? have you really even watched the games?
ReplyDeleteto say Gerrard has been one of our best performers to me is just pure madness.
this just proves once again that statistics are the biggest lies.
Ironic response given your criticism of gerrard for not scoring despite his general creative contribution
ReplyDeletein all fairness jason. lucas kept fouling he wouldve been sent off. he wasnt up to speed today due to his fitness. i wouldve taken allen off aswell though
ReplyDeletecompared to sterling, allen never gives ball away.
ReplyDeleteI thought he was very fair to be honest. All he said was we were too tentative in the first half and have them chances, which is true, but was pleased with the response, which was good, and we could have got a result. Nothing over the top there
ReplyDeletebut what about the 70 mins we were hanging on
ReplyDeleteyou can blame allen for the "allmost" goal. none has mentioned agger though? the first goal RVP too three jogging steps diagonally inside our box! agger was right next to him but didnt bother marking him well. it resulted in goal. somehow none has mentioned it here, wonder why Allen is crucified for something that resulted to nothing?
ReplyDeleteit seems like at the moment allen isnt playing to his strenghts. i dont think he has to be involved in build up play.
ReplyDeletehe was bought to keep possession, pass, move, pass, move, to give options in center of the pitch. and that he does fantastically.
my missus said there was more chance of me gettin a blow job than pickin up 3 points today her lips are sealed as normal !
ReplyDeleteI'm sure Zanatos is not done yet :)
ReplyDeleteZanatos, i'm not trying to have a go I can see your passion; I think all we're saying is it seems you are venting your frustrations without being entirely fair.
This does not shape the argument one way or the other but Gerrard is a legend and I do think deserves a little more respect than to have his head called for.
dear Jamie, it's time u admit that B R is a poor manager. Frankly, if u think dalglish, who has won several lge n cup titles before, is lousy, B R is worse with no hope of even winning any trophy.
ReplyDeleteIt seems to be out of fashion to actually back the team and the manager one supports. Try my hardest to stick with what I've picked up in the old days.
ReplyDeletehis whole demeanor when we lose is nonchalant.....as though we lost but its okay i know what im doing and you know nothing.....whats funny is when we lost the other week he was questioning the attitude of some players ...hell never do that if Gerrard and Allen start and they where both p*ss poor...hes an hypocrite....and an inconsistent coward in his attitude to his players
ReplyDeletegot to be joking. terrible first touch that always gets away from him under pressure, and his passing is ok when hes not under pressure normally sideways. he cant tackle. just wasted money. spearing twice the player he is
ReplyDeleteGreat to see someone else still trying to see positives.
ReplyDeleteAs for Allen, some people concentrate on what he does wrong, but turn a blind eye on the things he does right. Don't get me wrong, I'd have expected a bit more of him up until now, but technically he is a very sound player. He'll come really good eventually.
gerrard bottled a few tackles today, which at first I thought probably because of the man in charge. but obviously not.
ReplyDeletebest game web has had for us, despite utd players falling over, he only bought a couple
It's not the only authority. But stats are facts wether you agree or not. If the stats show gerrard has more assists than anyone in the prem, do you say that is wrong because its 'your opinion'? If the stats show gerrard favourably compares to all the other midfielders in the league in the key creative areas (I'm sick of writing this) but key passes, chances created, crosses etc then is that wrong because you and Zanatos think so? There are other aspects of the game that are intangible and open to interpretation and opinion but these stats are facts pal. And if these make him 'very poor' all season then what does it say for the other midfielders in the league? No one is saying he's the best in the league full stop, or he's as good even as he was, but very poor? That is ludicrous and other than a lack of his usual goals (which can be part explained by his change of position deeper) what are you basing it on?! You can't say he gives it away that much as he has one of the most number of successful passes in the league, you can't say he hasn't contributed because he has the most assist. So what are you judging this 'poor performance' on?
ReplyDeleteGerrard isn't his old self anymore, and in quite a few games his performance wasn't of a good enough standard, he seems to get better again. He does a lot of good things, too. And he actually didn't chase to many balls he'd lost in the past few years either, so no big change there. He still is top (or thereabouts) in the league's table for assists, mind.
ReplyDeleteI'd also add why do they keep track of these stats if not to judge the players?!
ReplyDeleteHe probably should be played further down the pitch nowadays as he doesn't seem to have the same level of energy as he used to have.
ReplyDeleteIf find the "as normal" part in your sentence worrying.
ReplyDeletedont worry its my birthday soon bbj!!!!
ReplyDeleteYeah I just mean off the bench maybe give him a chance that's all. Wisdom should start ahead of him of course
ReplyDeleteFar from it. But As Joe Allen plays deeper than Gerrard, I would not expect him to have as many assists. I stand by my point stats aren`t everything, they are useful, but I never said they weren`t. Not everything though, once you see that you too will have made a break through. You failed to explain why we have such great stats but we aren`t 1st in the league? Surely with players who have the best stats, we should be? How could it be we aren`t, if Stats say we should be? must be driving you up the wall working it out right?
ReplyDeleteAssist stats, don`t show one player to be better than another, it all depends on how each team is set up. Say for example we as a team create 50% more chances a game than any other team in the prem, or rather provide Gerrard with 50% more chances to create a assist, BUT he only coverts a extra 5% then surely he has under performed, even if your stats say he had more than other players of other teams. Stokes keeper has made more saves than Reina, does that make him a better keeper? or just have a worst defense in front of him. Players in Holland score loads more goals, does that mean they are better than RVP/Rooney/Suarez etc purely due to stats? Or does other factors come into it
I ain`t trying to argue with you, just you seem to want to.
Gerrard has played in the AM role a lot this year, over 50% of our games. If you don`t think he has, there aint a lot I can do. So what do I back up my stuff with, a mixture of things, not just one item alone. I have never once said I am right, just my own view that he aint up to it anymore. Makes no difference to me if you like that or not, my life carrys on just the same.
I have no Bias against Gerrard, he is one of my all time favourite player. Which says a lot as the world has seen some awesome players. Don`t mean I`m going to back him regardless.
Well said.
ReplyDeleteAs a part of a bigger picture, that is why Scouts also watch players, so I would like to ask, if Stats are all that count, why do we send out Scouts to watch them? As by your logic when I said from watching him I felt he had been below par, you went mad at me, surely this is what a Scout does too, maybe they should all be sacked, and just log into Opta Stats in the future
ReplyDeleteWhy would I want to elevate him? because you said so? You can`t make this up. Guess what I did form my view from watching him, just like Scouts do. I know thats a bit out there, judging a player from watching him, prob wont catch on, but If it does, you heard it hear first.
ReplyDeleteIt is not Ridiculous, attack the argument not the person. Why do you dis like others having a different view?
ReplyDeletenoooooo now you done it, stats say he should stay where he is, how did you base this theory of less enegry? Was it from Opta, if not it wont count hahhaa
ReplyDeleteSo due to his status, we should keep playing him forever?
ReplyDeleteI as you will see from a lot of my other posts think Allen is not as bad as most say, but needs the two other mids to be the right types for him to excel. He is just the new Lucas or Downing, easy target to throw stuff at.
ReplyDeleteSpot on, he seems to get blamed for other players not doing there role correctly. Don`t get me wrong, he needs to step it up, but he aint as bad as what some make out
ReplyDeleteNot really, as I stated The three of them don`t perform to well when played at the same time. Do you just have a personal problem with me?
ReplyDeleteThe ref was very good IMO
ReplyDeleteThis games LFC should be using formation 4-4-2 but NOT 4-5-1 .they let suarez alone to scoring the goal.This will give advantage to united defender. LFC much better to let Coates playing CDM position.Tough and high level games need to used tough physical players.Coates very suit to get this position.
ReplyDeleteSounds like Suso to me!
ReplyDeleteAnd Henderson. Another easy target, at least last season. Why some people have so short memories that they don't learn out of experiences like this.
ReplyDeleteNo, it's the impression I've got from watching every game. :-)
ReplyDeleteGerrard's Opta stats are pretty good though!
good lol we should be looking at the 70 mins when we were awful
ReplyDeleteyes it worked fine ?how many points did we get today
ReplyDeletehe fouled because he was making tackles ,unlike half the team who went through the motions
ReplyDeleterodgers will be here for a long time ,people swallow his b"llshit,the yanks probabley thought that was a good game of soccer
ReplyDelete