Here are the figures for all Liverpool managers from 1959-present (all competitions):
| | Years | Total | Wins | Draws | Total | % | |
1 | Kenny Dalglish | 6 | 307 | 187 | 78 | 265 | 86% | |
2 | Joe Fagan | 2 | 133 | 70 | 37 | 107 | 82% | |
3 | Bob Paisley | 9 | 535 | 307 | 132 | 439 | 82% | |
4 | Rafa Benitez | 5 | 315 | 178 | 69 | 247 | 78% | |
5 | Bill Shankly | 15 | 783 | 407 | 198 | 605 | 77% | |
6 | Gerard Houllier | 7 | 325 | 165 | 81 | 246 | 76% | |
7 | Roy Evans | 5 | 244 | 123 | 63 | 186 | 76% | |
8 | Graeme Souness | 3 | 157 | 65 | 47 | 112 | 71% |
It’s no real surprise to see Graeme Souness propping up the table (!). Gerard Houllier and Roy Evans are neck and neck, and at the moment, Rafa Benitez is slightly ahead of Bill Shankly.
How do Liverpool’s managers compare with other successful managers of the last 50 years?
| Years | Total | Wins | Draws | Total | % |
Alex Ferguson | 23 | 1299 | 762 | 305 | 1067 | 82% |
Arsene Wenger | 13 | 755 | 435 | 187 | 622 | 82% |
Jose Mourinho (Chelsea) | 3 | 185 | 131 | 36 | 167 | 90% |
Martin O’Neill (Aston Villa) | 3 | 152 | 61 | 49 | 110 | 72% |
Matt Busby | 25 | 1141 | 576 | 266 | 842 | 74% |
Brian Clough (Notts Forest) | 18 | 907 | 411 | 246 | 657 | 72% |
George Graham (Arsenal) | 9 | 460 | 225 | 133 | 358 | 78% |
Don Revie (Leeds) | 13 | 699 | 365 | 190 | 555 | 79% |
Bobby Robson (Newcastle) | 5 | 255 | 119 | 64 | 183 | 72% |
Kevin Keegan (Newcastle) | 5 | 272 | 144 | 57 | 201 | 74% |
With a 90% unbeaten ratio, Mourinho’s record at Chelsea is pretty amazing; and he is the only manager in the English league over the last 50 years with a better record than Dalglish.
The following table ranks all the above managers against each other:
| | Years | Total | Wins | Draws | Total | % |
1 | Jose Mourinho (Chelsea) | 3 | 185 | 131 | 36 | 167 | 90% |
2 | Kenny Dalglish | 6 | 307 | 187 | 78 | 265 | 86% |
3= | Joe Fagan | 2 | 133 | 70 | 37 | 107 | 82% |
3= | Bob Paisley | 9 | 535 | 307 | 132 | 439 | 82% |
3= | Alex Ferguson | 23 | 1299 | 762 | 305 | 1067 | 82% |
3= | Arsene Wenger | 13 | 755 | 435 | 187 | 622 | 82% |
7 | Don Revie (Leeds) | 13 | 699 | 365 | 190 | 555 | 79% |
8= | Rafa Benitez | 5 | 315 | 178 | 69 | 247 | 78% |
8= | George Graham (Arsenal) | 9 | 460 | 225 | 133 | 358 | 78% |
10 | Bill Shankly | 15 | 783 | 407 | 198 | 605 | 77% |
11= | Gerard Houllier | 7 | 325 | 165 | 81 | 246 | 76% |
11= | Roy Evans | 5 | 244 | 123 | 63 | 186 | 76% |
13= | Matt Busby | 25 | 1141 | 576 | 266 | 842 | 74% |
13= | Kevin Keegan (Newcastle) | 5 | 272 | 144 | 57 | 201 | 74% |
15= | Martin O’Neill (Aston Villa) | 3 | 152 | 61 | 49 | 110 | 72% |
15= | Brian Clough (Notts Forest) | 18 | 907 | 411 | 246 | 657 | 72% |
15= | Bobby Robson (Newcastle) | 5 | 255 | 119 | 64 | 183 | 72% |
18 | Graeme Souness | 3 | 157 | 65 | 47 | 112 | 71% |
Souness lets the side down again (!). Rather surprisingly, Leeds’ Done Revie is very high up the table, only slightly behind Ferguson and Wenger.
I have to smile at the fact that Rafa Benitez has the same unbeaten percentage as George Graham, whose Arsenal team were renowned for their cautious, defensive approach (‘Boring, Boring Arsenal’, anyone?) ;-)
Overall, a fantastic set of results for Liverpool’s managers down the years.
Jaimie Kanwar
Jamie, rather than looking at their unbeaten percentage, can you do a follow up article looking at their win percentages as well. It would be interesting to see. Nice article.
ReplyDeleteThat's on my to do list ;)
ReplyDeleteHe is up there with the best and still you and the whole media criticize him for every single move he makes? Well Rafa has done a good job and over the next few years i see Liverpool getting better and that % can only increase. He is the best around and to replace such a manager isnt easy, and he definitely loves the club. And finally Torres is back this week and we have a full squad to chose from this weekend. Hopefully we would see Auilani as well and it wil be a gud game. YNWA
ReplyDeleteWhy do you make this type of analysis so unwieldy and complicated? Why dont you just do it on points per game? It is so much easier to understand that your statements of wins/losses/undefeated, etc. After all, it is just points that counts. And to say Sounness "lets the side down again" -- what you expected him to climb up the third table having coming bottom of the top? ;)
ReplyDeleteAnyway, here is the list on a wins/game:
Jose Mourinho 2.32
Kenny Dalglish 2.08
Alex Ferguson 1.99
Arsene Wenger 1.98
Bob Paisley 1.97
Rafa Benitez 1.91
Joe Fagan 1.86
Don Revie 1.84
Bill Shankly 1.81
Kevin Keegan 1.80
Gerard Houllier 1.77
Roy Evans 1.77
George Graham 1.76
Matt Busby 1.75
Bobby Robson 1.65
Brian Clough 1.63
Graeme Souness 1.54
Martin O'Neill 1.53
Note that the difference of Rafa's record compared to Alex F and Arsene W's is c3 points over a season
What is interesting is that Graeme Sounness had a higher points per game average than your favoured Martin O'Neill....
http://lfcglobe.com/the-start-of-the-bastion-of-invincibility-2/
ReplyDeleteThanks, Mr. Bombardier!
It's not unwieldy and complicated at all. It's very simplae and straightforward. And I if I wanted to do points per game I would've done that. This is about who has the best unbeaten record, which is a completely different thing.
ReplyDeleteI immediately looked at the tables for the points per game ratio like Hmmm, rather than at your "unbeaten %", as as Benitez needs to learn and as was just accentuated last season, you have to "win" the Premiership, not "not lose" it.
ReplyDeleteI was surprised to see Roy Evans compare so well with Houllier, as although he's been my favorite manager of recent times, the general consensus from the media would be his teams were all style with no substance, whereas Houllier finally delivered a winning mentality to LFC again.
Unfortunately in Evans' days, the English league wasn't as rich and prestigious at is is now, the Champions League was a knockout competition and only open to the Top Two (something that Souness made sure was VERY difficult to obtain) and consequently Evans was not able to attract top calibre players to Liverpool, or I think that he would've moved up that list considerably and be at least comparable to 'The Tactical Genius' in terms of results.
Still, players of the reputation of Hyppia and Reina would've been accessible (only maybe in the case of Reina), and definitely of the required calibre to push his teams into serious contention for the League/Champions League, but we just could never find them until it was too late... :(
I'm not interested in points per game - it's been done a million times on different sites. Why would I repeat what's already been done. Unbeaten ratio hasn't been done, and a comparison with non-LFC managers hasn't been done either.
ReplyDeleteI agree with you abou Roy Evans - I was a great fan,m and I loved watching his teams play. If he had had the money Houllier and Benitez have received, I think he would have won the league.
Some good info there... Well done jamie!
ReplyDeleteTho i do wonder if the stats would be more than slightly better if you did this before the season started?
In favour of rafa that is!!
ReplyDeleteYou're right - if this had been done before the start of the season, Rafa's figures would have been slightly better:
ReplyDeleteTotal games: 294
Wins: 168
Draws: 66
Total unbeaten games: 234
Overall unbeaten percentage: 79%
The stats show how good a manager Rafa is. We have a fit squad which has had a much needed boost in confidence. I think we should hopefully go on a good run. By the way you just couldn't help yourself could you with that dig comparing Benitez and Graham near the end of the article.
ReplyDeletePerhaps you should remove the stick that is so clearly lodged in your behind and get a sense of humour.
ReplyDeletefine. can you tell me the benefit of looking at unbeaten vs. points/game.
ReplyDeleteLast season, Liverpool had the best unbeaten record but didnt win the league.
It's beneficial because it's interesting.
ReplyDeleteLast season is ONE season; and I'm not just looking at the league, I'm looking at all competitons over a long period of time.
And as you can see, there is a definite correlation between being unbeaten and measurable success i.e. the winning of trophies.
iam so happy to join this
ReplyDeleteI think the correlation is stronger with points/game? Dont you?
ReplyDeleteI just realised a slight problem with your points-per-game figures: the total games figure in the tables above refers to game in all competitions, so to include all of them in the calculation is not strictly accurate ;)
ReplyDeletei just used your data. so, if that is case, then I suspect your unbeaten ratio is equally inaccurate too.... =-O
ReplyDeleteHow can it be inaccurate? My unbeaten ratio is for all competitions, not just the league. The end result is unbeaten percentage in an all competitions.
ReplyDeleteTotal games = total games in all competitions.
It would be interesting though to see the points per game average for the league.
Maybe I don't find you that funny.
ReplyDeleteThere are lies, damned lies and statistics lol.
ReplyDeleteNo amount of statistical analysis can measure the greatness of a manager in personality terms. The great managers have something more than tactical acumen..it's about personality. The ability to inspire, motivate and lead young men. Benitez is a very good manager. But i dont think he's a great one.
And these charts don't reflect the reality of the dire football his teams have played to achieve those stats. I mean, watching Liverpool over his term has at times been tortuous. It's grim stuff. If i set my teams up with 2 holding midfielders that basically NEVER score or create goals, only 1 striker and no genuine attacking width i'd probably do alright too in terms of points per game. But to watch it would never be much fun.
So anyway his unbeaten record is 2% better than Evans or GH.
ReplyDeleteIsn't that actually quite shit, bearing in mind he's had double their transfer funds?
sorry - misread your post. :-[
ReplyDeleteTake a look at this article I wrote:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/606/A60145175
As you can see, Benitez's win ratio over his WHOLE career has been excellent. Better than Wenger and Ancelotti. Only Ferguson has a better record.
When looking at just unbeaten, I'd agree. But how many of those unbeaten games were wins? How many were draws?
ReplyDeleteYour figures for Benitez are wrong - you have only inluded his games for Tenerife, Valencia and Liverpool. That is not his ENTIRE career. He also managed Valladoliid, Osasuna and Extramedura. I have researched this extensively - including his games for those three clubs - and his overall win ratio is 51%, not 55%.
ReplyDeleteWikipedia is wrong. You shouldn't always trust it.