6 Dec 2011

Insult to injury: How Kenny Dalglish got it wrong against Fulham...

Liverpool's 1-0 defeat against Fulham leaves the club five points adrift of fourth place, and it's now looking like an uphill battle for Champions League football next season. Kenny Dalglish's team has put together a great unbeaten run over the last two months, but as we saw again last night, some of Kenny's decisions are mystifying to say the least, and they continue to cost the club valuable points.

The plain fact is Liverpool have struggled to score league goals this season, and a fatal inability to finish clear-cut chances was - once again - a major problem against Fulham last night.

Dropping Maxi Rodrigues

Kenny's treatment of Maxi Rodrigues is increasingly questionable, and dropping the Argentinean again despite his goal record is tantamount to negligence in my view. How does that decision make any sense for the team? How is it fair? How is it an effective motivational tool?

Liverpool's finishing issue has been self-evident since the start of the season, but the failure to deal with it is arguably the bigger problem. Surely, when your team is struggling to score goals, you do everything you can to rectify that?

With that in mind, in what universe do you leave on the bench a player who has scored 10 goals in the last 9 starts?

The team was set-up for the Maxi-Suarez-Bellamy triple act, but instead, we got Carroll lumbering about ineffectively in Suarez's role upfront, and Suarez in Maxi's role on the left.

With all the chances Liverpool created, it's conceivable that Maxi (with his comparatively excellent finishing) would've scored.

Ignoring the past

Liverpool hammered Fulham 5-2 in the same fixture last season, and Maxi scored a hat-trick. That day, the team was set-up in a similar 433 formation, but there was real balance in the team; a clear emphasis on pass and move, and the right players were selected to do the job.

Why did Daglish ignore the lessons learned from victory? Why change the whole emphasis of the team's approach by playing Carroll instead of Maxi? If it aint broke, don't fix it.

Price tags dictating team selection?

Money talks, and Dalglish is clearly trying to justify the huge financial outlay on the likes of Andy Carroll and Jordan Henderson*. What other reason can there be for playing Carroll - who has a paltry 2 goals in the last 16 league games - ahead of Maxi?

* Henderson played well overall and justified his selection

Non-goalscoring subs

To add insult to injury, Maxi didn't even get on as a substitute. Instead, with Liverpool desperate for a goal, Dalglish brought on two players who haven't scored a league goal between them in over 35 hours of football this season (combined).

When you need a goal you surely bring on the person most likely to score, and with ten goals in the last nine starts, that was obviously Maxi. Or am I missing something here?

Carroll, but no Downing?

Why play Carroll if you then decide to leave Downing on the bench? I'm not the biggest fan of the former Villa man but I was under the impression that one of the reasons he was bought was to provide ammunition for Carroll?

Playing Carroll as the figurehead of a three-man attack with Suarez and Bellamy is a complete waste of time; he does not have the speed, guile, touch, creativity or game intelligence to do the job effectively.

Tactically, it doesn't make sense. If Carroll is going to play then the team has to be set-up to get the best out of him, and that means wingers putting crosses in. Expecting Carroll to adapt to free-flowing pass and move football is an exercise in futility.

I'm as big a fan of Kenny as anyone else but decisions like this are costing Liverpool valuable points, and could end up costing the club Champions League football next season.

There's no point going on about how many chances have been created, or how many times players have hit the post. In the grand scheme of things, these things mean nothing.

It's a cliche, but football is a results business, and there should be no room for favouritism or sentimentality. The only thing that matters is end product, and there are no awards at the end of the season for missed-chances, hitting the post, or playing well and constantly drawing.

Forget everything else: Liverpool need to score goals, and to do that, the players most likely to score goals need to played regularly.

It's a devastatingly simple idea, but one that Dalglish seems intent on ignoring.

Of course, Liverpool can still finish in the top four; the club is not out of the race by any means, but if Dalglish persists with these mystifying decisions, then Liverpool could be well off the pace sooner rather than later.

N.B Please stick to the comment policy. If you can't hack a fair, critical approach then perhaps you should visit a different site.

Jaimie Kanwar


  1. spot on comment...definitely Caroll not belonging to L'pool...he's the bad side of Crouch....he failed to justify his presence...I'm just wonder why its took too long (80 min) to understand the formation is not working.....

  2. On this site a few days back a lot of fans were calling this Liverpool side the best counter attacking team in the country, that was shocking and was just based on the back of two games against a suspicious Chelsea defence that have been leaking in goals.  

    Man City 48 Goals
    Man Utd 31 Goals
    Chelsea 31 Goals
    Tottenham 29 goals (game less then everyone else)
    Arsenal 30 goals
    Liverpool 17 goals.

    It is clear we are off the pace in front of goal in comparison with our rivals, it is about time fans start calling a spade a spade, and with Andy Carroll he is just not good enough to be the clubs most expensive signing. He offers nothing and is actually detrimental to the way others play. We need a goal scorer badly.

    Suarez is not clinical but we have seen enough of him to work out he will create chances for a partner, there is no link up between Carroll and people should just accept it is not going to happen or wait in vain for it to "gel"

    January - Striker is the priority or another year without CL football awaits.

  3. Hard to disagree with anything you have written there. I just do not get the Carroll / Maxi conundrum?? My only explanation is that there is something going on behind the scene's that we are not privy to, though for the life of me I cannot begin to imagine what that is.

    I was glad when we signed Carroll as he had done so well at Newcastle at the beginning of last season. To me, he now looks completely disinterested, unfit, cumbersome and a liability rather than an asset. Something needs to change with respect to him.

    And, for ****'s sake, Kenny, PLAY MAXI!!!

  4. its a nasty circle this. only a few weeks ago it was why don't we play bellamy nobody was saying why not maxi now bellamy is playing and not really scoring many so we turn to why are we not playing maxi when he gets regular football and stops scoring it will be why pay 35 mill for a striker and not play him. Kenny can not win with the modern lfc fan who just constantly finds something to moan about

  5. The solution to Liverpool's problem is quite simple ... get rid of KK and make Jaimie Kanwar Liverpool manager.

  6. I completely agree with everything you've said there Jamie.

    One further thing that has troubled me all season though is the apparent apathy from the bench towards our performances. Dalglish is paid to be a manager, not a fan, and as such he should be looking at ways to impact games with his decisions not just wait to cheer goals like the rest of us. We’ve consistently seen the team lose its way in the second half of games, but Dalglish seems to be incapable/unwilling to do anything about it. For all the platitudes about it being a squad game, it does not appear that way if the manager refuses to trust his second options to sub in for anything more than 10-15 minutes.

    (fwiw I was calling for any/all of Spearing/Adam/Carroll to be subbed from the 60 minute mark - which is the common standard for an initial sub - as opposed to Dalglish consistently waiting until the 75th minute or later, if he does use his subs at all that is!)

  7. I disagree. Many fans have seen from the start that the best way forward is to play Maxi-Suarez-Bellamy. KD has refused to do this because he wants to accommodate his transfer flops in the team, and Liverpool have suffered as a result.

    If Maxi plays regularly and then stops scoring then he should make way for someone who *is* scoring at that time. Football constantly changes, and inflexibility is a killer. At this moment in time, Maxi is scoring every time he plays, so he must play. If at some point in the future Carroll scores in every game, then obviously the same would apply.

  8. well said Richard.

    there are only 11 places in the starting line-up. this was also the first game without Lucas. i thought we played well enough to have won the game, but again for the keeper or the woodwork to end up as man of the match !!

  9. I don't see the nasty circle that you mention at all Richard. Fans are simply calling for those players that underperform for a number of games to be dropped, and a fair chance given to others in the squad.

    Maxi only started playing again in the last few weeks, at which point he justified his starting place and led to calls for him to continue starting at the expense of those who were deemed to be failing to deliver (Downing/Henderson)

    Before that, Bellamy put in a few good performances which led to calls for his inclusion in more starting lineups at the expense of another underperforming counterpart (Carroll), and tbf that hasn't changed as yet.

    You say that the modern LFC fan just wants something to moan about but Kenny Dalglish says that LFC doesn't accept second best. And right now we aren't even close to challenging for that!

  10. Fulham hit the woodwork and forced our keeper into a number of saves as well, so they can argue that they fully deserved their win too though...

  11. im convincing myself every week that kenny is a bad manager and he really is, I dont wanna talk about  mistakes hes making every week not playing maxi playing caroll etc. but I wonder what FSG is thinking are they watching us playing like this and are they monitoring kenny, kenny is stubborn and wont change his mind his idea of having full british squad is just stupid and hes going to waste more money in the next transfer windows buying over rated english players, im saying maybe its time to sack kenny even tho it might sound harsh right now, hes a legend and everything but hes a bad manager and thats it , hes proved it already, we just cant continue like this anymore, top teams getting more points every week and we struggle all the time drawing too many games and now starting to lose again this is unbearable.

  12. kenny just simply doesnt know his best team or his best formation for that matter!

  13. Unless Carroll is dropped and Maxi starts more games Liverpool will be playing Europa league next year. The absence of Gerrard should also be noted in our goals scored margin

  14. I just think maybe fans forget how prior to Maxi's run of goals, we used to often think he was anonymous in games. Maybe by using him in this fashion, Kenny is getting the best out of him? Also i completely agree about the Carroll conundrum, we have to play 4-3-3 with fluid players upfront, ie Suarez, Bellars, Maxi or Kuyt. I think the reality check last night provided shows we are a work in progress but we no longer have any 'dead wood' and we have players who will grow in potential, this is still a predominantly new team. More players are required in january, I'd like a Fox in the box type to play in behind defenders, off the shoulder with Suarez slightly deeper. I wanted us to try for Higuain in the summer, maybe dreaming a bit there lol.

    I think we all need to remember how Lucas was treated a few years back, we need to not criticise the likes of Carroll and Henderson but encourage and give them time. In Kenny we trust YNWA

  15. Филип Митровић1:15 pm, December 06, 2011

    I would wait at the end of the season and sack kenny (if we dont make top 4), because i cant understand why is he playin carroll (he doesnt deserve to be in starting line-up at the moment) and not maxi, or kuyt. I also cant understand why we played through the middle, and not down the wings if we must play carroll??? Against fulham we played mainly through the middle. We are losing points, other teams (above us) last night wouldn't drop points like us.

  16. As you can see here the crops like downing,hendo and adam are bough to built around carroll,can you point to any of those lads are good at ground passing with creativity ?,most of the time they just loop or long passes in every game and as a fan of kenny i'm not criticising him just a mere fact like the wee man said no one is bigger than the club,sort it out fast.

  17. I think Kenny's time is up - he's playing Carroll simply cos of his price tag and sacrficing points as a result, the same for Hendo (although he did play well last night). i seriosuly question his wisdom and thoroughly peed off with the result and the apparent stubborness of KK.#

    I have no faith in the team, I appreciate it is a work in progress but we are miles away from Man City, Manure, Chelsea, Arseanl and Spurs. We are a top 6 side an that is it - the table does not lie. FORGET 4th evrybody - it is NOT happening. The other teams are better equipped to deal with the lesser teams - Liverpool only raise their game for the big games and that is not good enough. time and time again this season we have been exposed for what we are - mid table mediocrity with an average stubborn manager who really does not know what he is doing. Drop Carroll FFS and sell him, he is nothing but a liabiity, he offers nothing whatsoever and Kenny needs to sort himself out because he is damaging our chances for anything.

    Maxi shoudl have started but because of price tags he has been left out - shocking decison making (shocking is not the right word, treachorous is better)

    And by the way, reina has been lookin shaky for a good few weeks nown and his spillage yesterday was infuriating - he's made a few mistakes this season!

  18. We have so few natural or prolific goal scorers in the squad that when one player is in the goals they deserve to stay in the team until there performances justify them being dropped. Dalglish says people are in the team on merit, but a lot of his team selections don't show that imho.

    Dalglish has to try and integrate new players into the team, and also justify the money spent players, especially with some of the vast amounts of money that has been spent.

    Lucas could be left in the midfield to improve, because Benitez had belief in him, and you can wander about in midfield making little impact and not impacting on the result too much. But that was one player. Dalglish obviously has faith in the players he's bought, or he wouldn't have spent so much, but trying to integrate too many players at once, especially when a lot of them are under performing is not a good idea, and can drag the rest of the team down as players settle for a lower level of performance.

    We obviously don't know what goes on behind the scenes, but everyone can see that Henderson and Carroll have not been working, and neither has Downing come to think of it. When we have played well and got the results, then the ones who played well should carry on. I'm no big fan of Maxi but he has been doing the business, and so deserves a run. Dalglish saying that he may be past it pre game may was to try and justify his non inclusion, but may not be good for morale.

  19. Meritocracy needs to prevail in Liverpool squad selection. If a player is doing well he should be kept in the starting line up. For as long as Kenny continues to play players with hefty price tag despite their poor performance, Liverpool will continue to suffer. I totally agree with you Jamie, why fix something that is not broken?

  20. If you can guarantee Europa League, then that would be great in this transition period. :-) I'm not so sure unless we improve.

  21.  So had Jay Spearing not been sent off and Carroll scores the winner then everybody would have said what a brave and great decison it was to start Carroll etc. Calling team selection with hind sight is pointless, i dont see it happening when we win.

    We are five points off 4th and have a decent run of games coming up that i can see us winning.

    Heck i can remember after the shocking miss vs Chelsea last season that people were saying Maxi couldnt hit a barn door etc and that he had to go. He grabbed a couple of hatricks and suddenly he is a lethal finisher?

    Maxi's record is 13 goals in 48 games. Take into account the two hatricks and Maxi has only scored in 9 games of the 48 he has played for us.

    Carroll hasnt had a run of games since his arrival, he was injured and since he has been back playing he hasnt had a good run in the side. When he was scoring regularly for Newcastle he was playing week in week out and looked alot sharper. There was definate improvement from him last night in terms of holding the ball up and getting into a few good positions. It takes time to overhaul a squad,be patient.

  22. You've listed teams that are gonna finish above us..just look at the lesser teams below us and their goals scored.

    Somebody is to blame...

    ADAM with no creativity NOT TO BLAME..
    .DOWNING..no goals and assist..NOT TO BLAME...

    .we have won 2league games at home this season and the wins came against BOLTON and WOLVES .

    newcastle have 19goals
    villa 16goals
    Bolton 19goals
    blackburn 21goals
    Sunderland 16goals
    Wolves 15goals
    Everton 15goals
    norwich 20goals
    qpr 15goals
    fulham 16goals


  23. Carroll is dog poo - I see nothing in his game worthy of admiration whatsoever. Patience my eye - he has no decent touch, his heading is average at best, I haven't seen tt seen anything of his famed left peg and he doesn't link up well with anybody.

    I hate to say it but he is crap - we've been done over on the price and KK is playing him because simply because fo the money shelled out, and this is a dereliction of duty to the club, and if KK won't drop him, he should resign

  24. I dont think any true red wants Kenny out, if you do you are an uneducated numbskull and your lack of football intelligence offends me, we have played some of the best football i have seen from a red's team in recent history. Personally i'd be more worried about Carroll in a game against a top 6 team as opposed to a lesser opponent, if carroll doesn't play against the likes of Fulham, we get criticised for wasting money so kenny cannot win if he plays carroll or not. And Hendo has actually won me over recently, his performances are improving rapidly. As i said, Lucas has turned it around, i have faith over the next few years that Hendo and Carroll have room to improve. So judging players under 21 in less than half a season is hardly fair, but neither am i saying they should be in the starting 11. 

  25. Agreed mate, As i said maybe Kenny gets the best out of Maxi by using him sparingly. Ignore that manc's reply below, he replied to me and got put down. He said we are miles away from Man City, Manure, Chelsea, Arsenal and Spurs, yet we have only been beaten by Spurs out of that lot, needless to say Adam's sending off made that easier. As other games against top 6 teams have proved, anyone can beat anyone on their day, but a sending off will help

  26. what a wasted carroll ! why did kenny loves to stuck with his expensive flop. be reallistic here. players who performs should get the game not otherwise. when we bought carroll,people said we will get more crosses & best header of the game. but i don't see any goal since he's been here. our crosses & corners are shit,our header(carroll) even worse !!! what a crap ! i woke up 4 a.m in malaysia to watch this game but end up really dissappointed. if kenny stuck to this selection,we not ganna get 6th place i'm sure.

  27. I have to agree Jamie.  I don't necessarily think that maxi's 'recent' goalscoring record should have made an automatic choice (given his record spans over 2 seasons), but i completely agree that a front 3 of Bellamy, Maxi and Suarez was in order last night.  I thought so before the game and certainly haven't changed my mind now!  The movement and pace of those 3 would have been far more of a threat that shifting Suarez and Bellamy toa ccomodate Carroll.

    Bellamy has to be played further forward than he was last night.  Up alongside Suarez with licence to roam.  thats how and why we looked so dangerous against Chelsea.

    Just 1 side note as i can't 100% agree with you Jamie :) Kenny quite clearly is prone to a suprise selction or 2.  I did not think Carroll would play last night and i clearly agree with you that this was a mistake.  However, it is suprises like that which ultimately lead to Maxi being included ou of nowhere at Stamford Brodge in the league, and sometimes theses decisions will pay off.  In addition to that, it could be possible that Dalglish bases a lot of his decisions on things outside of our knowledge, training for example.  There is now way of knowing, but perhaps Maxi had impressed in the build up to that Chelsea game and that's why he was included, and who know's, perhaps his levels have dropped since.  All im saying is, the manager is clearly privy to more information than we are and there could well be reasons behind his decision.

    having said that, i would have played him and i was very surprises to see him not even come off the bench!

  28. i agree with this article jamie.
    There isnt a single fan out there i have come across that dosent want the carroll suarez partnership to be honest goals win games and goals is the one thing the team (besides some of the very good football being played) is currently lacking.

    I notice alot of blame shunted towards carroll but its the whole team including suarez who has been guilty of missing good chances in many games tis turn but his overall brilliance makes us turn a blind eye to it bellamy also had a few good chances last night.

    although i agree Carroll needs game time to build his confidence and understanding of his role and positioning, its coming to the point where we can no longer afford to keep putting out a team that isnt producing the goods which presents a difficult dilemma for kenny dalglish, what to do with a player that cost £35m but currently dosent have the ability to effectively spearhead your team and to some extent holds them back.

    i would say if we havent already done so we need to hire a class shooting coach to teach our attackers how to stay compose and finish

    but as for the carroll problem, that is a headache no manager would wish for...do you ship him out? leave him to deteriorate and loose confidence on the bench or continue to play him and jepordise the progress of your side, i feel sorry for kenny!

  29. i do agree with you redwill about the improved performance last night, he got more involved moved the ball quicker got into goal scoring positions more often etc but he did fade out and wasnt able to produce the goals we needed to kill the game

  30. I think you might have seen Maxi come off the bench if it wasnt for the sending off. Once that happened we could not afford to put Maxi on as Kuyt and Downing are more solid defencivly. Ok we did conceed but i could see the logic of putting Kuyt and Downing on to offer defencive as well as offencive qualities.

    Most people seem to think Carroll has alot of potential but is not showing it. If he doesnt get game how does anybody expect him to get back to his best and to get sharper? When do you suggest we play Andy? Pick a game?

    As mentioned in my earlier post, Kenny is not only looking at the short term but trying to develop the young players he has bought. This is nothing to do with price tag but the age of the players and the potential they possess. The more game time they get the more they will improve. Its a tough balancing act trying to improve and intergrate young players while still getting wins, sometimes this will go wrong, its something we will have to accept for at least the rest of this season. Transitional phase is definatly underway and i wouldnt be surprised to see Kuyt and Maxi leave at the end of this season as Kenny looks to bring some younger stars into the squad.

  31. ........Maxi's record is 13 goals in 48 games. Take into account the two hatricks and Maxi has only scored in 9 games of the 48 he has played for ......

    If you take his two hatricks away then shouldn't you take the two games away aswell ...should be 9goals in 46games...but i suppose if you hate a player then anything is allowed to suit your argument.

    If Henderson scored 13 goals in 48games you'd try and justify that he's world class..same for Adam..same for downing..same for Carroll.

    I will say that between Adam..downing..Carroll..Henderson WILL NOT GET 20 goals between them in the season.

  32. I think there's something we are completely missing irregardless of who has played. We have a terrible record this season of scoring from corners and free-kicks.

    We are the only team in the EPL who hasn't scored from a corner and apart from Gerrard's goal against Man Utd haven't scored from a direct free-kick. Charlie Adam did also deliver an assist for Suarez against Sunderland too from a free-kick. 

    Last night was another example of an area we need to spend more time focussing on the training ground. We got a couple of free-kicks in good positions that led to nothing. As his been the case this season, 3 or 4 players stand around trying to decide who will take it. As for corners again we had more than our opponents and apart from an Agger header that went past the post none were threatening.

    I don't think you can blame that on personnel. More on a lack of practice in these areas between games.

    Overall the Spurs game excepted we have been pretty consistent in our application and performances. We go to opposition grounds looking to win and last night we looked like the home-team until 72 minutes. Our defence with the occasional exception of Glen Johnson looks excellent. We just lack a cutting edge. An improvement from set-pieces would ease the pressure.  

  33. Agree with you 100%..say how things really are...not how we wish they were and try to convince people that milk is black...

    In kenny we trust????not so far

  34. Hey dude, just a simple phrase "we need more players in Jan". This statement hurts a lot. If you are the new owner of the club, how much more will you spend on a team that has just spent more than 100 mil in a short span of less than a year? Mind you, before this 100 mil spent, it's not as if the old Liverpool team is made up of 1-2 mil pound players. 100 plus mil spent + old set of players = challenge for position 6 or 7 in the league?! What the heck is this?

    As fans for an elite football club like Liverpool, we need to look not only at results on the pitch, but the financial well-being of the club as well. The new owner is much better than the 2 old dudes previously but they don't own oil fields, unfortunately. I think we have said too much about the creditability of the transfers of AC, JH & SD. Basically, I have lost confidence in the manager's tactical ability and player selection, more importantly, transfer decisions. I really don't want to wake up in the morning seeing reports saying that Liverpool is going to pay 60 mil for Danny Graham of Swansea and Anthony Pilkington of Norwich (Both English players each scored 4-5 goals till date for their clubs this season).

    Give more time simply means Liverpool is not going to Europe again this season. For a team that has player valuation near to 200 mil (my estimation), I think it's ridiculous. So right now, are we fans going to hope that Liverpool will not be caught up by Stoke City in the league standings?

  35. Jaimie, I agree with you fully on your article, KD's first 11 decision was definitely a mystifying one. Just one lil comment though. If its a Suarez-Bellamy-Maxi triple act and Maxi plays on the left, who plays on the right? Bellamy? No way! Maxi the inside forward plays left - correct. Maxi the winger can play right, basically that dude can play anywhere upfront. But Bellamy on the right as a winger, would definitely be a career first. But then again you could of meant Bellamy as the second striker and Kuyt on the right, or Bellamy as the treq and yes Kuyt still on the right.

  36. Kenny made the greatest mistake before the season even started and that was the idea of playing a 4-4-2 formation .....

    You could clearly see that the 4-2-3-1 system we played at the end of last season was just perfect for us - two holding midfielders (Lucas&Spearing), a superb attacking full back (Johnson),  one attacking midfieler (Meireles) behind the striker and two wide forwards (Suarez&Maxi) and a striker (Kuyt) ... we had great balance, defensively sound and great going forward.

    We attacked in numbers with at least four players in and around the box .... that's how you will be guaranteed goals.

    We don't do this anymore ....

    Kenny should just have bought another striker and another classy wide forward instead of Downing and Henderson - there was absolutely no need to do this .... Downing doesn't suit the kind of 4-3-3 formation and Henderson doesn't come close to Meireles or Aquilani, so why on earth did we do this ????

    And please folks don't come up with Carroll as the reason, because why shouldn't he be able to play in a 4-3-3 formation ..... crosses can be provided by the full backs or from the wide forwards occasionally or even from deep midfield .... so there is no reason to go for a 4-4-2 .....

    Next thing is, that Suarez plays so much better in the role of a wide forward than a centre forward - he likes to dribble, take on defenders, he likes to be involved creating chances and has great vision. All these attributes are perfectly suited for a wide forward role. On the other side, he isn't the fastest, nor is he the most clinical, which aren't the traits you look out for when you want a fantastic striker, do you ??

    It's the reason why Suarez never ever plays as centre forward for Uruguay when Cavani is fit .... Luis is a wide forward and that's his best position without a doubt !!

    Just look at this:

    What we had (without buying anyone and without Gerrard);







    What we have now (after around 50M spent);






    What's better, you decide .....

  37. This is Kenny Dalglish and his nostalgia tour I called it when he was appointed and I'm repeating it.

  38. what utter rubbish.   

    Suarez is the biggest offender missing chances.  Are you going to say he's a waste of time?

    This is such a negative site.  Ok, we get it, you don't like Carroll.

    And as for not understanding buying 21/22 year olds, or why didn't we buy Aguero - give me a break.  Such clueless fans.

  39. Adebayor's salary can even make Joe Cole cry foul. Dzeko would of been a better option. But what City wants City gets. My vote would be for Edison Cavani. A Cavani-Suarez-Maxi combo would be  a handful for any defence. If all else fails, all 3 can shout instructions at each other in Spainish that is sure to confuse any English defense :)

  40. and what of the games we're not finishing when Carroll isn't playing?

  41. People are entitled to their opinions; just because you don't like them doesn't make the views wrong. Are people not allowed to query Carroll's underwhelming performances? Is it not warranted?

  42. I agree with your take on things: Bellamy as second striker, Maxi inside left, and Kuyt on the right (until we get a better option).

  43. Totally agree, Scotty. Free kicks, corners etc this season have been consistently poor. These definitely need to be worked on.

  44. John Henry stated that his expectation is that Liverpool finish in the Champions League Places at the end of this season.
    I can assure you the Kenny Dalglish will be sacked if he fails to do so.
    John Henry is no fool and you need only look at how RUTHLESS he was in turning around FENWAY PARK.
    He'll have no compulsion in removing Kenny.

    The real problem here is the failure of the British Purchases that Kenny made ...there just not good enough.


  45. Disagree about Adam, and Henderson, who I think is the one player who actually will come good (if he's played in the right position). Adam has been excellent, and for 8m, he's a bargain.

  46. Well said.  sometimes this site becomes a blinkers on slating effort where the big plan is pretty plain to see.

    Chelsea - play the senior guys.
    Fulham - get the young guns game time.

    The reality is all of the seniors except gerrard are out of contract at the end of next season, which means this summer is decision time in letting them go, or extending them for an extra year.  
    Most are likely to go if not offered an extension which is unlikely to happen to anyone who is or nearly 32.

    So the young players must be developed to determine the transfer needs next summer (and avoid the Carroll scenario).

    The final thing that is assumed by so many here is that any player we want from overseas is going to be
    a) a guaranteed success in the EPL.
    b) just dying to come to lfc whatever ECL or wages others are offering.

    This is an important month, but given the lower league opposition it's simply a no brainer to play the younger players.
    You have to support it if you're a fan.

  47. Great points, Roberto. The Carroll conundrum really is a tough one. I don't feel sorry for KD though; no one twisted his arm to sign Carroll. He made the choice, now he has to make it work, and hopefully he will.

  48. Too bad when that happens, Benitez would of been poached by PSG :). Not sure if his love for Liverpool is greater than the moolah PSG has been throwing at everything recently. I say we poach Paul Lambert :). He's Scottish, he's from Glasgow, has played for Celtic, basically he has the 3 things one needs to be a qualified Liverpool head honcho. :)

  49. Yes, you're right. There's always the possibility that the surprise decisions you highlight can make the difference. Unfortunately, Carroll's selection was only a surprise for Liverpool fans; Fulham's defenders were probably hoping he would play because then they knew he'd be easier to handle than Suarez.

  50. so go and support someone else.  You clearly don't buy into this club's vision so why suffer so?

  51. Big plan? Give over. I suppose the big plan this season has been to draw all our home games, and struggle against inferior opposition too? Playing different teams based on the opposition is silly - you play your best available team every game, which is why I don't think your contention is very accurate.

    The Fulham game was just as important as the Chelsea game; you get three points for both, and given the fact Liverpool are not in the top 4, aiming for victory by playing those players who actually score has to be a priority.

  52. Wow just what game/s have you lot been watching? Honestly were playing some good stuff,poor finishing and refereeing has cost us.
    Granted I'm bemused by Maxi not playing but apart from Spurs we,ve played every team off the park.  I can,t help but wonder If any of you have watched the games or just the highlights.The drivel above just shows a lack of transfer knowledge and football basics.Were you decrying the signings when we beat CFC twice in 9 days or played city off the park.Realist that,s how its correctly spelt,like you,re post A REEL LIST to catch fish(Whoppers).Or are you really that angry mad,insane.

    Kenny,s here for three seasons get behind him and the team and save the critical nonsense for seasons end.Support like this site should be an example of how peoples pc,s/laptop bring out the nob-ed in them.ho ho 

  53. You are not the arbiter of who is and is not a fan. Your views are welcome but stop telling everyone how to support the team.

  54. Well said.  

    This article is about Carroll not scoring and being the problem, at 22.  
    Lets face it Suarez has been more wasteful than anyone.  What a terrible buy.

    We didn't lose because Carroll didn't score last night.  

    Or because Spearo didn't keep his foot down (didn't help), it was because Hendo, who apparently had a good game despite not working the wing again, didn't come out and close down Murphy, and Reina made a schoolboy error.

    Truth is none of the club have been scoring, so why the anti -Carroll articles AGAIN.
    Truth is this is not a real fans site, it's for getting clicks.  Simple as.

  55. She tie It,
    John Henry has stated his expectation of a Champions League place at the end of this season.
    You should look at John Henry's past with the FENWAY PARK.Amount of fan power will stop JH if he wants Kenny out trust me on this.Bare in mind where we would be without John Henry. 

  56. King Kenny, stop your ego trip and drop Carrol.We cannot wait for another 3 seasons for Carrol to come good and in the meantime we keep finishing at 7th place season after season.You have made a mistake admit it like a man.Stop ruining your reputation.You said no one is bigger than the club but you yourself do not practise what you preach.

  57. The 'Carroll is young and need time brigade' need to remember that Messi, Wilshire, Eto'o, Gerrard, Owen, Fowler, Shearer, Sutton, Rooney, The REAL Ronaldo and so on and so on were all doing it at 17, 18 and 19.  If your good enough your old enough. 

    Now what we forget is Carroll had all his boys round him at Newcastle who would mollycoddle him like Nolan and Barton. THESE guys were the TWO BIGGEST INFLUENCES in the Newcastle dressing room.  When you're untouchable in the dressing room your confidence naturally soars to new arrogant heights.  Without that Aura of invincibility in the dressing room Carroll really needs to man up and start showing some authority.  Ian Wright and Ian Rush would go apeshit if the ball wasn't played to them at the right time and at the correct weight. A shrug of the shoulders from Carroll simply doesn't cut it.  If he wants to be a success here, with his limited ability, he has to get into the head of our players by bitchin and complaining and at the very least showing that he cares.  He came with a reputation of being a wild child.  If you took the edge or nasty side away from Rooney, Alan Smith, Roy Keane, Patrick Viera or Drogba they'd be half the players they are now.  Unfortunately Carroll doesn't posses enough natural ability to be 'half the player'. If this boy doesn't stop trying to be clean cut and rediscover his mojo its game over. 

  58. You may not have noticed but Henderson wasn't actually playing on the wing last night. And Murphy was directly faced up by Johnson when he had his shot - where exactly did you think Henderson was supposed to be closing him from??

    Adam's tendency to just back away from the opposition every time they moved towards, instead of actively engaging them, WAS a major problem throughout the game for me though...

  59. Those who argue that there is nothing right at the club are no more, or less, tiresome than those that love to argue that there is nothing wrong and everything going on is the best that we could possibly hope for...

  60. Carroll IS the best that we could possibly have hoped for for just £35m.

    After all, no quality players have EVER gone to a team that wasn't in the Champions League before... *sigh*

  61. It's only a bargain if you actually needed something in the first place. We didn't need Adam as we had Aquilani and Meireles, and it's hard to argue that he's an upgrade on either, so even that was money being splurged just for the sake of it...

  62. Kuyt has been terrible all season. I'd rather see us promote the kids and let them sink or swim, than continue to roll out underperforming players in unsuitable positions...

  63. Mr know it all..so what if Carroll is 22..is he still in his nappies ...does his mam still tie his shoe laces..if Carroll is 22 and he deserves 4-5years to learn..then how about David Ngog who Is three months younger..and he came to us at age of 19....you never gave him a chance....and he only cost 0.5million ..why the hypocrisy....

    But in king kenny we believe...just wait till next year when Andy Carroll will have scored 20+goals (not). And we are in 7th position....

    Dream on

    as for aguero he isn't good enough to play for us . why buy him when you can have CARROLL.??

  64. Im glad you have pointed out the David Ngog comparison, I would ask people who are defending Andy what exactly does Carroll offer that Ngog didnt? (based on performances at LFC thus far)

  65. Ditto - Spot on with that

  66. Mate..we are told by some that CHARLIE ADAM corners and free kicks are 10million on their own...haven't seen it my self BUT YOU JUST GOT TO BELIEVE .

  67. Dude, I still remember vaguely the disappointment I had as a 14 year old of how Michael Thomas won the league for Arsenal in the 88/89 season. So it's not as if I just started supporting Liverpool this season. To see where Liverpool is now in the league standings pains my heart, all Liverpool fans are feeling the same way, I supposed. But by supporting the manager's decision in all aspects of the game wholeheartedly is really something outside my capacity. I just hope Liverpool can realize it's full potential with the present team.

  68. Kenny should be giving Eccelstone or recall Amoo and give them ago now, to many chances not being taken and it is beginning to get annoying and frustrating to watch.

  69. Why should Kenny be sacked? The football is the best we have played in years it is the strike force which is letting Kenny,Fans and the Club down
    why can't we take our chances?
    Kenny should have played Maxi I can never understand it under Houllier with Heskey and not Fowler and Rafa with dropping Crouch after he had scored.

  70. Adebayor was on loan at Real Madrid last season playing Champion League football Aguero wanted to play Champions League football you call yourself the reelist but talk about players that were never going to join. Bent had already joined Villa before Torres had thrown his toys out of his pram! Kenny tried to buy Mario Gomez before Carroll who everyone was banging on about being the best forward in the league last season.

  71. a problem is that suarez almost never makes a nice early pass to caroll. often suarez will take the ball the other side of carolls run and try take a crazy shot. its happened so many times this season. suarez is bloody greedy in this respect and you could see that caroll after a point loses interest in making runs when he is almost never fed the ball. 

    this is not to say caroll is without criticism, because he most surely is not. i wish he would run into the box and get onto a header instead of standing like a statue in the 6 yard box totally stationary and waiting for a pin point cross. 

  72. Well, that I can understand.  
    In my mind, we couldn't just buy who we wanted, particularly in January when we were in danger of being branded a feeder club.  

    There's people on this site who think that because Carroll's nominal price was similar to Aguero's we could have just bought Aguero, or someone like him and they would have jumped to come to lfc.  I think these people are clueless.  eg the mali fellow.

    I think it's pretty certain we couldn't get our first choice options but had to show that we had ambition - there was even a rumour that we couldn't get a 27 yr old Italian so went for Bellamy instead.

    And in terms of the half dozen or so players bought in, young guns especially, using the 1st half of the season and the lower league sides to make sure they all get good solid game time to develop seems like sound strategy to me.  You don't want to use the last 8 games of the season to do it.  

    If it works and gives us a good run in to the end of the season (even if not full development), that will be tremendous.  Hendo and Carroll at 21/22 need likely a couple of seasons. Adam also needs work but bench time won't do it.

    Carroll didn't have a good game last night, yet that's not why we didn't get a result.

    Senderos could have had 3/4 yellow cards, should have conceded a penalty and Suarez' goal was brilliant and should have stood.  

    That was the game wrapped up, but I can't remember a game where the officials had such a big impact on the outcome.

    As for Reina's fumble, Johnson was covering Murphy to go for the line, but Hendo I think, standing in the box, should have backed him up by closing and covering his eventual movement to the centre and shot.

    So I trust the game plan, the vision.  It's a strategy and we will buy more players if necessary.  It's not guaranteed, but buying for a top 4 place is tough when you're not in there.  

    Newcastle have done amazingly, but they would have been quite happy if they were in 10th place and would have been more than happy with their purchases.  We're in the gutter at 7th.

    Now I wouldn't have bought Carroll, even though I liked him, purely because of his mobility, but it was complicated that time, and if we're up against it come the last 8 or 10 games you can be sure Kenny will be ruthless in his selection.

  73. Jaimie, your comment confirm what we had known all along, KD was the wrong appointment for LFC and the longer he stays in the job, the more damage he would do to our beloved club. For example, the continue selection of Carroll is no more that an ego stroking part on KD and clearly it had cost us points, again.

    We are heading the way of when RH was at our club and only seriously delusional fans would still want KD at our club. Many fans i spoke to had long given any hope of us winning the league as long as KD is in charge, heck consider ourselves lucky IF we even qualifies for the Europa league. Mid table mediocority, we better get used to it beause this is our new home under KD. Heck i wonder why we went through all that troble in getting rid of RH, we are back in the same place more or less.

    John Henry must be decisive and sack KD NOW to stop this spiral of doom that KD had brought to our club, there is still time but must act now.

    Oh, stop listening to so called fans whose sole basis for suppoprting KD WAS his role in the past as a player and the tragedy. Don't get me wrong, we appreciates that dearly but this is 2011 and we last won the league in 1990 and the manger;s job is to bring us forward and ultimately success. IF KD can's do it (obviously he could not as evidence had shown), its time we get someonle else who could. Since we are into second coming, Rafa anyone?

  74. Wow.. Didn't realise the whole Liverpool team has scored only 3 more goals than Van Persie the league's top scorer on 14 goals.
    I certainly hope he doesn't finish ahead of Liverpool on the goals chart.

  75. That was quite strange to label the 30 year old Argentine closer to his "KK"'s age and therefore could not play all the games yet play Bellamy the 32 year old Welshman the extra game Maxi was missing out on because of old age. 
    These 2 are both effective and should be played without bring ageism into it or dare I say nationality?
    I have noticed some here saying Carroll is young and needs 3 or so seasons but they need to realised KK signed a 3 year contract and this may not be extended meaning a new manager can come in and want his own set of players that are not called Carroll, Downing, Henderson or Adam just like KK is side-lining or shipping out players he did not buy.

  76. jamie that is the best article i have ever read on your site! great words mate. i could not agree more with EVERYTHING you said.

  77. clueless how?? yes suarez is missing chances but i dont think anyone can argue about his quality...the others havent showed anything yet. And why buy 21/22 year olds for THAT AMOUNT OF MONEY - we're not a settled team, we were in need of strengthening immediately, surely that money would have been better utilised on a proven established player. your the typical blind fan, through some stupid belief that you cant question anything, and have made yourself the clueless one.

  78. yes but there would have been no 35m transfer fee for adebayor and as it was a loan we wouldnt make a huge loss i he wasnt a success. agree 100% with you edinson cavani, amazing player and would be deadly with Luis...

  79. i would love Rafa back. your words are spot on tho we all thank and love kenny for his achievments at our great club but we are tactically putting ourselves out of the race for champions league with these baffling tactics from KK. Arsenal and chelsea have had their slump for the season and we now have to play catch up and hope spurs have a massive slump through out the season cos we are too far behind both manchester clubs. it is still early tho but player selection policy and plan b and c usage has to used 100% EFFECTIVELY!!!!

  80. think people misinterpreting what i said about hendo....i think he's a decent player who has got potential..not questioning his ability just questioning whether we really needed to sign for that fee. Adam gives 100% no doubt, and he never hides but he hasnt got the quallity we need in the middle of the park..too many times he's been dominated by average midfielders...a liverpool midfield which has boasted the likes of steven gerrard, xabi alonso, javier mascherano in recent years means there is a high standard in my eyes and charlie just isnt good enough compared to these guys.

  81. Adebayor wanted to play Champions League football so he joined a team which qualified for the Europa League and whose ambitions match our own (namely getting in the top 4). 

  82. i for some reason think that maxi's contract has a massive goal bonus in it and a certain fee for playing matches also on top of his set salary. so maybe cos HE SCORES SO MUCH for us they dont want to pay the bonuses????? thats all ive got i have no idea if its close to the truth at all??? but yeah i dont know either its baffling!!!!..............

  83. the modern lfc plan does not say "i wonder why we dont play carrol, he cost us 35mil"
    the modern liverpool fan says "i wonder why we play carrol"

  84. its not anti carrol! it is the fact that we all want our BEST team possible played every game! read the article properly"johnnysingapore"

  85. i agree. i have noticed reina spill plenty of saves lately and a couple have almost resulted in dempsey like goals.

  86. No you shouldnt take the games away, it is a fact that he has SCORED in 9 games out of the 48 he has played for us. Scoring in a game means that he scored in the game, it doesnt matter if its 1 or 3 he still scored in that game. He is doesnt score in a game he doesnt score, its quite simple. Maxi has been on the scoresheet in 9 out of the 48 games he has played for us.

    My point was that he is not a player that scores in most games he plays hence why the figure was relevant. Im far from a Maxi hater, i like Maxi, all i was saying is that you can say that he would have scored or that he would have been a better choice as he scores 1 in 5 games he plays for us. That is a fact and not an opinion, sorry if you dont like this highlighted.


  87. We all know the Fulham is just as important and still 3 points, however the belief from the management team must have been that they could get some game time for the developing players such as Carroll and Henderson and still win the game. If we had won (and should have won albeit for the red card imo) then the young players would have got a vital 90mins and we still come away with a win. As i said it is a juggling act that will sometimes go wrong. Do you see SAF playing youngsters in some games and developing them? Yes of course you do but he juggles the balance of youth and experience  better than most managers and has built many sides doing this over time.

  88. Yes he will make it work by not giving Carroll any game time at all. Falmpalm. Cant have it both ways, hence my earlier comments about it being a juggling act.

  89. Last January Adebayor was playing in Spain when we brought Carroll.

  90.  Or






    With Maxi, Carroll , Henderson, Kuyt all on bench ready to be brought in.

  91. Totally agree, but its gonna have to be some purchase in January to fire us into the top 4! Bearing in mind our transfer history in the last two windows! He's gonna have to hit the ground running. Of all the feasible options out there, I'd be taking a good look at Tevez on loan. He scores EPL goals for fun and would be a total menace to any opposition, even without Suarez, but the two of them together!... 

  92. If Carroll isn't dropped, I very much doubt will even get into the Europa League! Again!

  93. The point is players will go to the best available option - there are only a small group of clubs that can offer Champions League football, more money AND a regular starting berth for players. Downing would've wanted Champions League football if that was on offer, but the simple fact is that we were the best option for him so he jumped at the opportunity. Similarly, we would've been the best opportunity for many quality players that are stuck in less than ideal situations.

    There is simply no way that LFC were backed into a corner where we were forced to make a player with 6 months top flight experience one of the most expensive players EVER

  94. Career first? Bellamy played from the right on Monday!

  95. we did for Lucas and everybody is apparently so happy about that decision...

  96. I didn't even bother reading to the end of that ridiculous comment.  I could tell it was stupid.

    Fact - we've created a ton of chances, just not finished them, from a host of players regularly slated on this site and from those praised.

    Fact - we DON'T have the pick and choice of players these days as people on this site seem to think.

    Fact - lfc were in danger of being labelled a feeder club.  FSG totally removed this impression at a stroke,  albeit an expensive one, and then again in the summer.

    Fact - this end of the season you try and get the new players playing (against lower league sides).  
    You don't do it in January when we play Citeh 6 times (and when you might be making txfer decisions), or the bitch of a February that we have, or the season run in after that.

    If there has been a mistake it's bringing too many players in at once, that's always a tough gig and not always successful.  This lot are having to create a new system up front.

    But impatience and a seriously ageing 1st team, and strategy meant we have - in order to lay the platform for next summer's buying. 

    FSG would rather be very very picky about extending senior player's contracts next summer when they will all have just one year left (except Gerrard).  Most could well move on.

    We know Carroll can be effective, he needs games.  this end of the season is the time to play him, against lower league sides.  

    A fan would support this and understand what's being done.  Not too many of those here though.

  97. I wouldn't have bought Carroll personally, but it was complex and we don't have endless choices anymore.  I don't even think he'll be an England regular, I would rather have had Odemwingie.

    But it's about understanding the vision, the way to get there and being a fan.There are no guarantees, but this is the time and these are the sides to make it work against.  

    Support cannot be endless, but the management will not try endlessly either.  

    Have some faith and see the wisdom of trying it now not January with our multitude of Citeh games, the bitch of a february we've got or the season run in.

    If he gets his sharpness and end result up he'll be a great sub in the big games in 2012 and kick on from there.  

    We know he can get on the end of things, he's just not doing it consistently yet and is not being serviced like he can either.

  98. regardless of whether we have beaten all them teams apart from Spurs, we are still in 6th, and is wherewe deserve to be. It does say something when even though you are beaten by your supposed "rivals", they are still above above you in the table, and by some distance - Manure, Citeh, Chelski, Spurs and now Arsenal. The problem is the manger and his team selections, but cos it's KK he is untouchable - pathetic

    typical that you brand me a manc, or not being a true red - and what the **** are you? Some scally self pittier, where everyone else is to blame as usual? - truly pathetic. You do not have to be a scouser to support Liverpool FC, - that opinion is for inbred scouser muppets like yourself (that is indeed if you are a scouser?), and everton fans

    Face facts, Liverpool are average, with average players and an average manager, in an average position in the league - we have our place and we will not climb anyhigher with KK in charge. the teams above us are better, as even though they have been hld or beaten by us they are miles away from us. they are improving all the while, whikle we are slowly but surely falling by the wayside, and will continue to do so for the rest of the season. 4th is a pipe dream, and even the most blinkered LFC fan woudl accept that - actually know, most LFc fans are blinkered and live in dreamland most of the time

  99. Great points, Cookedbacon.  I disagree that KD is an average manager - I think he's a very good manager, but the table doesn't lie, and Liverpool are where they deserve to be.