9 Nov 2011

Carroll? Henderson? Downing? Will the resale value of Dalglish's players increase...?

Since returning to Anfield, Kenny Dalglish has spent more than 100m on new players. Which, if any, of these players could be sold at a profit for Liverpool in the future?

One of FSG's goals is to buy young players with a view to increasing their value over the duration of their contracts, with Liverpool (hopefully) benefiting in the meantime.

The club has spent a lot of money over the last 11 months, but how many of the club's new signings will actually rise in value to the extent that when they come to be sold, the club will make a profit?

For me, the only players who will rise in value are Luis Suarez, Charlie Adam, Jose Enrique, and possibly Sebastian Coates. No team on the planet is going to pay Liverpool more than £35m for Andy Carroll, and no one is going to pay more than £20m for Stewart Downing.

With regards to Jordan Henderson - it's possibly his value might rise over the next few years but to be honest, I just can't see it. Henderson does't have the 'X' factor; that special skill or ability that sets him apart from other players. He'll probably grow into a decent midfielder, but a £25 or £30m midfielder? Sorry, I just can't see it.

If these players were put on the market today, I think Liverpool would struggle to recoup even half the original cash outlay. Prices for British players are always inflated but when it comes to how much another team would actually pay, here are my projected values:

* Andy Carroll: £10-£12m

* Stewart Downing: £8-£10m

* Jordan Henderson: £10-£12m

* Jose Enrique: £12-£15m

* Charlie Adam: £10-£12m

* Luis Suarez: £30-£40m

Jaimie Kanwar


  1. Hopefully haircuts could make the differences.

  2. Another positive post Jaimie, I bet there's a right feelgood factor in your house. Gonna start calling you Collymore! Haha.x.

  3. You would not have thought Alonso could be sold for anywhere near as much as he was based on his first year.

  4. Any Old Iron ?


    Are you a Cockney Muppet JK ?

    LFC are not Rag and Bone Men , we spent the amount of money necessary on a requirement we dont try to live for free of the sweat & efforts of our staff .

    We are not Slave traders , or cheapskates , that isnt "The Liverpool Way" .

  5. What always confused me was the price Arbeloa went for. I know that's random but he wet for dirt cheap to a rich club. We hardly seem to make a profit on anyone but to be fair, big clubs never seem to.

  6. There's always a feelgood factor in my house; just ask my wife, Morticia, and my kids Wednesday and Pugsley; barrel of laughs at my place!

  7. Are you mad? Man utd were quoted £25 million for alonso the season before he signed for liverpool. The big bid for him never materialized, and they had already signed mikel arteta as a replacement for him, so they had to get rid of a brilliant player for a knockdown price. And it was obvious early on in his first season that liverpool had signed a star.

    Rafa was looking for £18 million when he was trying to sell him to arsenal, so liverpool were always going to make a big profit on him. particularly if he played well for any extended period of time. 

  8. There are a couple of things that people should consider when talking about the possibility of making a big profit on luis suarez. He's a very good player, but liverpool did pay a lot of money for him. The thing is that if these financial fair play rules are going to have any effect, the number of clubs that are going to be able to pay more than £25 million for a player will rapidly shrink to Real madrid, Barcelona, man utd, Bayern Munich and Arsenal. And realistically only the spanish clubs would be prepared to shell out even that much for one player, even Luis suarez. 

    The only way of making a big profit on luis suarez would be to sell him at the end of the season, before the days of the big fees are over. and quite frankly that would be insanity from liverpool's point of view. He's not playing well enough to justify a mega bid, and quite frankly liverpool could do with hanging on to the one part of their attack that seems to be functioning with any degree of regularity.

  9. I was refering to his performance.  Start pretty poorly but improved.

  10. You're correct to an extent, however have you forgotten we made a tidy profit on Mascherano, Torres, Fowler, Alonso, Merieles to name a few.

  11. It's really depressing and a perfect indictment of the modern football fan that this question is even asked.

    Do you get 3 points for making a profit on a player? Is there a trophy for the most profitable club?

  12.  Arsenal & Bayern ... My Arse !

  13. I am extremely disappointed with how liverpool's transfer business has worked out overall since dalglish's return. The only bright points have been suarez and enrique. Rumours have it that the suarez deal was in place before kenny took the reins and he can't therefore take much credit for that. Enrique was second choice to clichy by all accounts as well so we were perhaps a little fortunate there.

    Hopefully the other signings work out in the long run but so far downing; carroll and henderson have been underwhelming to say the least. Adam has been ok but possibly to the detriment of the more expansive attacking style we had at the tail end of last season.

    As things stand I don't believe that we will make the champions league spots which is a full scale disaster given the amount we have spent. Fingers crossed the new signings and the team in general picks up from here on...

  14.  Thatta Boy Jerry !

    Keep you knockin em in like that & we will be Champions again in no time !!!

  15.  Any old Iron ?

    Wheres me'Muppet Video !!!?

  16. Regardless of whether you ascribe to the more commercialised view of modern day football. Surely you understand that you expect stuff to be better if you pay more for it. On that basis it's entirely understandable that people are disappointed in the performance of our costly additions. 

    Your point above that liverpool pay what is necessary for requirements presumes 2 things: the new signings were in fact requirements and that liverpool didn't pay vastly over the odds. I would disagree on both counts.

    We needed new signings but not the new signings we actually got.

  17. Arsenal are one of the five richest clubs in the world, and make a profit. They're one of the few clubs that could afford to pay more than £25 million for a single player out of their own income, but they probably wouldn't be interested in buying an already famous player, from a rival club, as that massively inflates the price. 

  18. What an odd post.  Why not keep them if they are good enough?

    A bit weird.

    Again, the kids are here with their tears 'the new signings are rubbish' - a great conclusion after 11 games, where we actually lost 2 and are only really guilty of playing a bit below par and not converting chances.

    More unrealistic expectations from the playstation brigade.

  19. Depressing. This tirelessly negative agenda which is surrounding Liverpool's blogs it's really embarassing.
    The factory of negativity is open 24 hrs a day: an insane pressure after just 11 games.
    Modern football fans are disgusting me.

  20. I wonder, who are the genius expecting someone to pay higher than £35mn, £20mn & £16mn respectively for the 3 English garages?  Adam's highest bid was around £8mn, at his peak & now he is a proven small fish in big pond (& surely at 27 he 'll not get any PHASTER)

    Jaimie, I think in total valuation you are right, though, I feel, you have put higher values for the Brits & lower for the others.

    Real might spend more than £40mn for Luis, before he turns 26;  PSG, ManCity, Berca, Real or even Chelsea (Cole is almost 32 now) 'll definitely spend more than £15mn for Enrique next July, if he continues his current level.  & Coates was probably bidden higher than LFC by some Ukrainian club, not sure, but he 'll definitely draw over £10mn next year. 

    Investment on the 3 English players are damn wastage, we can expect at best 35% (£25mn) for them now.  If the 3 continues maintaining their current standards, we should try to sell them ASAP to minimize the loss; by the next summer, we might have to loan team, that too after sharing the salary (Like the previous English Messi)

  21. Come out of your dreams man.  Arsenal is probably at the best possible financial position now.  They have a big stadium, for which, most part of the building cost is covered by the naming rights, they have a great sponsor behind them, one of the biggest spenders & an egoistic competitors of UAE Maniacs & they have the best youth team in the world. 

    Have to ever bothered to see the profiles of some of the 17-23 aged gunners?  Do you think Wenger sold Nasri or Cesc to balance his books?  Fool, he has his backups under his sleeve, bullied out Barca & ManCity, rather giving obnoxious long-term contracts to players, who were clearly blackmailing on their last year of contract.

    Arsene has the money & I am sure he 'll bring most of Goetze, Hazard, Marvin Martin, Remi, M'villa, Gourkuff, Shakho etc. to add with Ramsey, Walcot, Van Persey, Grevinho, Wilshire & few others.  They play the most attractive game & in 2/3 years time 'll start to dominate the EPL, one his young gunners start to mature.

    & I am a LFC fan.   

  22. Even if Carroll ever comes good and becomes one of the bestr strikers in England, we will never be able to sell him for more than £15m.
    Same goes for 27 y/o Downing. Never £20m.
    Hendo still may show some class, and may be sold for the same amount we bought him.

    For some unknown reason we gave away Meireles on the cheap, and Aquilani too. I remain convinced that should Aquilani stayed for another year and demonstrate his class, we could have sold him to Italy for around £20m. But instead the club treated him like some sort of a deadwood.

    Every day in Summer I would open my comp and check if we are after some 'marquee signing'... when we ended up with Downing, Adam and Henderson minus Meireles and Aquilani, my gut feeling told me exactly what is going to happen. And That is what's happening now.

    Hopefully we get a decent striker in January. I would say we need someone versatile, like van der Vaart, who can be both an attacking midfielder and a striker.

    Downing, Carroll are miscalculated risks. £55m. LOL. One could buy Everton for this money.

  23. Harry, I guess it was a hypothetical question by Jamie.
    When Comolli was trying to justify the purchases made in the Summer, he explained what were the incentives. And one of them was the re-sale value. You buy young and promising players with good stats, nurture them into stars and sell them in a few years for like twice more. But £35m? £20m? This is a joke. Who in their right mind will pay even half of that for the players like Carroll and Downing? EVEN if they suddenly become world class?
    And we have to bear in mind that we sold Meireles - our playmaker, for just £12m. Why, when Modric was estimated £40m? is Miereles 3,5 times worse a player than Modric?
    So people really try hard to see the logic behind our transfer business, and can't find it.
    Let's imagine that neither Carroll, Downing or Henderson live up to the expectations.... We just end up losing money (BIG MONEY). Because a) the sums spent on them will not have returned to us as a much persued place in the CL; b) No CL - no revenues, no good players that will want to join the club; c) we will need to sign new players who would be more efficient, but we will have to ship out the 'deadwood' first, and clearly we lose on the re-sale.

    So, let's of course give them all time and all our support. That's what we are for - to support. But realise that things are not going to suddenly become rosier if we just walk around in rose-tinted specs.

  24. IInflated prices for British players.....why is it always lfc who pays inflated prices and no body else.

  25. Your right matey, but I could name a hundred players from the last 10 years we made no profit on though. Oh, an Fowler doesn't count, lol.

  26. I'm not sure if profit  is a particularly helpful way of looking at the success of liverpool's new signings. selling off alonso, arbeloa, mascherano and torres for a £53 million profit didn't really help liverpool very much. Ideally you want to be successful enough to retain your best players, and the best way to do that is to be financially stable. If a club is breaking even it is in a better position to retain players it wants to keep, and continually invest in new players.

    Liverpool need to break even. Players appear in the clubs accounts as wages and Amortization. Basically, if these two figures add up to about 70% of turnover, then a club will break even. Looking at the last liverpool financial figures, their turnover was £185 million, so they would have broken even if they could have spent £130 million. However Wages and amortization added up to £154 million, meaning that liverpool's ratio was 85% and they had to sell xabi alonso and arbeloa to balance the books. 

    The cost of signing a player is spread evenly across a players contract, so andy Carroll's £35 million fee is spread across 5 1/2 years, so it appears as an a cost of 6.4 million, and he is paid £80,000 a week or £4.2 million a year. so in total andy carroll appears as a cost of £10.6 million every full year he is at liverpool. 

    Downing cost £20 million which over 4 years is five million a year in fees. He's on £70,000 a week (Most reliable estimate) so that's £3.6 million a year adding up to a total of £8.6 million a year. Jordan henderson Cost 18 million (halfway between 16 and 20) and is on £60,000 a week. over five years or £6.8 million a year. 

    If you add it all together, liverpool have to generate £26 million a year to pay for the cost of having signed these three players, and if they are to cut down the cost of the squad to 70% of turnover, that's a whole fifth of their £130 million budget. and only £104 million to spend on the other 22 squad places academy and staff. 

    John Henry spoke about overpaying for these players, but what he needs to realise that spending too much on players has long term effects. 

    These three players are going to impose a huge financial strain on liverpool. The would want to be brilliant. If you look at other players at other clubs you begin to get an idea of how much The Liverpool players cost. Man utd have paid off rooney's transfer fee by now, and he appears as a £9 million (£180,000 a week) wages cost. Andy carroll is very very expensive.

    Luis suarez at 23 million and £80,000 a week over 5 1/2 years works out at 8.3 million a year, making him less expensive on an annual basis than downing. You then start to get an idea of how expensive stewart downing really is. 

    But to give an idea of how liverpool should be doing things is to look at newcastle. They have a £40,000 a week wage cap, and they paid £4 million for yohan cabaye over 5 years, and signed demba ba for free, on a pay as you play contract. Cabaye appears as an annual cost of £2.8, and ba is £2 million. Is jordan henderson two and a half times as good as cabaye? is carroll five times as good as demba ba? 

    These are supposed to be the sort of players that liverpool should be looking at. Good cheap players, to fit a certain role, and for low wages. newcastle have gotten rid of a lot of discontent dead wood, signed cheaper players, cut costs, and have rocketed up the table like a missile. liverpool need to do the same thing, but on a massive scale. The best way is to bring players through from the academy, and use good scouting to find players like javier hernandez, or cheik tiote, or yohan cabaye or demba ba. 

    Liverpool fans should stop thinking big when it comes to transfers, and start looking for smart signings. The club needs to start buying young, cheap players who don't expect much in the way of wages, until they have proved themselves to be good enough, and these three players represent a huge wrong turn in the efforts to revive liverpool, even if they turn out to be pretty good players. 

  27. Haha, Fowler does count, he came straight out of the factory production line! so it's all profit!  Yes I agree, we've lost money on players over the years, but not hundred! lol that's over exaggeration!

    My view is this, you're either a feeder club to other clubs i.e. Arsenal > Man City or you keep your best players.  Other than Arsenal I cant think of many clubs who've made a neat profit on players.  

    I can also name you 5 great managers who've regularly got it wrong in their transfer dealings.  Therefore, I don't hold it against Dalglish at all for buying the wrong players.  I can also assure you under Kenny should we see success, you will see Kenny break the team up frequently and refresh the squad with new players.    

  28. Are you serious with your comment?? or are you posting to get a reaction? 

    Your comment is by far the most ridiculous I've read on this forum since I joined.  

  29. Are you serious with your comment?? or are you posting to get a reaction? 

    Your comment is by far the most ridiculous I've read on this forum since I joined

  30. Eh? in short all it says is that there is no way that they are ever going to be able to rebuild their squad on a balanced budget, if they keep pissing away enormous amounts of money on fees and wages. It doesn't really matter how good they are, these players are too expensive for liverpool to afford. 

    Something to consider is that the liverpool lost 4-0 to spurs there are couple of weeks ago. The liverpool players are paid nearly twice as much as the spurs players. Liverpool need to get better value for money if they're going to  get back near the top. 

  31. Selling the team off in November after 11 games!!!!!!!

  32. You read that people?? the way forward in football is to follow the Newcastle business model!

    Let's see if you're praising Newcastle at the end of the season.  Mike Ashley has only one business plan.  To become a feeder club to other clubs.  Buy inexpensive undiscovered talent and sell at a higher price.  He has no intention of challenging for medals.  

    Our Business model is currently the most advanced model in English , this includes buying young players and bringing young talent through, our Academy is second only to Barcelona.  

    Also, what are you talking about?? pissing away enormous money? we bought three established premiership players for 13m.  

  33. 2/3 years will dominate EPL? haven't we heard million times from Wenger?? haha.  

    Arsenal wont be winning anything in a very long time.

  34. oh for god's sake. To a certain extent every club is a feeder club to bigger clubs, until you grow to be big enough to retain the players you want to keep, and take a good profit on the ones you can replace. Liverpool had to sell benayoun and torres to chelsea, alonso and arbeloa to real madrid, and mascherano to barcelona, because they weren't doing well enough, and couldn't afford to keep them. 

    Mike ashley is a fool, and traditionally newcastle are a joke club when it comes to running the club as a business. But right now newcastle have taken a number of positive steps as they look to get their costs under control. They got rid of nolan and barton, who were highly paid, troublemakers. They've made some fantastic signings, who are outstanding value. and they are currently playing football with a level of organization and purpose that liverpool can only dream of. Their problem is still that they have a small squad, and who knows where they'll be at the end of the season. But they'll probably be better off than last season, with better players, and lower costs.

    St James park is now full every week. Newcastle will be on tv more often, every league place you climb is worth £750,000. Newcastle will have more money, and they still have a lot of the carroll money to gradually invest, as they gradually get high earners off the wage bill.  

    Liverpool's model is a shambles, Falling income, soaring costs, and bad value signings. After a couple of months john henry effectively admitted that he was shocked that liverpool had so many bad, highly paid players, on such long term contracts. A couple of weeks ago he admitted that he had overpaid for carroll and in the summer, to send a message to the fans. I'm not sure that he sent the message he intended. 

    The sale of fernando torres represented a big opportunity when it came to reshaping the side. Honestly, do you think that andy carroll, stewart downing and jordan henderson are going to get you any nearer man utd (man city being obviously out of the question)  These players cost so much that you should be expecting them to be providing the backbone of a great team. Right now they can't put a single foot right. 

    That's what liverpool should be aiming at. Definite improvements on the field and better value players, and a lower cost base so there is more money to invest on new players. Liverpool need to be as sharp as possible off the pitch to be able to compete at the top table. They have to stop making mistakes. 

  35. Who else has paid over the odds...especially to the extent we have

  36. Liverpool's model is a shambles? you really don't have a clue do you?  You've based your weak financial analysis after 11 EPL games this season.  Especially after seeing Newcastle's overwhelming position in the league and concluded this is the way forward for Liverpool!!

    You said Liverpool's soaring costs? Look Johnny Come lately, we took 17 players off our payroll this season.  Yes 17.  We brought in 9 players for a net spend of 38m.

    Under the current regime we have a bigger and stronger squad and most importantly trimmed our wage bill by 30m.  Very very impressive. 

    I say you need to stop making mistakes with your half baked analysis.

  37. Nah this is too easy.  I'll leave you alone to spare you some further humiliation. 

     Did n't united spend over £30 million on Rio?

  39. ah now, my financial analysis has nothing to do with the first 11 games of the season, and everything to do with liverpool's last couple of sets of accounts. The next set of accounts will include the cost of hiring hodgson, the cost of paying him off, of signing his useless players, and the cost of paying off the contracts of several squad players. 

    Liverpool did manage to get 17 players off the books in one form or another, but in order to get players to accept lower wages elsewhere, you have to make up the difference. Liverpool had to make it worth their while to leave. sure the blow will be seriously softened by the sale of torres, but its the long term trend that you have to worry about. 

    Then you have to consider how incredibly expensive these new players were given the need to cut costs. and how underwhelming they are on the pitch. If you don't make the champions league it could seriously hamper the rebuilding project. 

    But we won't have any idea about liverpool's accounts this season for 18 months because liverpool issue them a year late.

  40. Have you seen the accounts for Man Utd, Chelsea, Man City? all of these clubs are running substantial losses.  Manchester United HAVE to win the league and CL each season or they face huge losses each year.  

    If you're a football club you can't escape losing money.Why don't you take a look at the accounts of the most successful club in the last 3 years- Barcelona and tell me whether they are hemorrhaging money or not.  

    Contrary to belief Liverpool financially are in a very strong position.  We've cleared our debt and have better control over our finances.

    Your comments on how LFC is being run gives the impression that we have a bunch of incompetent individuals running the football club.  How wrong you are.

  41. I don't think that the people who run liverpool have a very good grip on what they are doing. I mean they'll get there eventually, but they weren't long in admitting that they were a bit out of their depth. The linking of the price of torres to andy carroll was bizarre. They admitted that they overpaid for carroll because they wanted to send a message to the fans which is kind of insane. Ian Ayre made a total spectacle of himself with his recent terrible outburst about the foreign tv deal. It's not all been smooth sailing.

    I think that it's important to recognize that liverpool are in quite a mess off the pitch, and it's proving to be difficult to get things under control. Liverpool  may have gotten rid of most of the debt, but that was only ever part of the problem. They also had a large problem with their costs, and falling income. And while they don't have interest payments any more, they don't have european football of any kind either. 

    You can if you want choose to place all you trust in yet another set of owners, but it's not really down to their personality, or how well they sell their vision of the club. They are in this to make money, and they can't make money while they are making losses. They need to get a grip on the things they can control like wages and transfer spending, and get better value than the the three north of england boys. 

  42. well said.

  43. What are on earth are you talking about dude???  Your waffling now.

    'I don't think that the people who run liverpool have a very good grip on what they are doing. I mean they'll get there eventually'

    In this comment you conclude that LFC owners we'll get there eventually.  This means they do know what they're doing!??!  That's what you're telling us.  

    Make your mind up pal!!!!!, do they know what they doing or not??

    You're using the word 'grip' like it's going out of fashion!

    Think you need to get grip of yourself and stop embarrassing yourself infront of all the readers here with weak arguments.  

    Despite removing 17 players from our payroll, reducing our wage bill by 30m, strengthening the squad for a net spend of 38m, buying 3 established premiership players for 13m.  From those figures, any open minded person  would arrive at the conclusion that the current management team have been cost effective.  

    It's one thing debating but another is debating for the sake of it Hopper.  

    Yes we overpaid for players, John Henry is new to this sport, he'll soon realise if he hasn't yet, that success at Football clubs come with a big price, just ask Barcelona.

  44.  Man U Jones,Rio,Rooney
     Man city Lescott,Milner and Barry

  45. Barcelona? Did n' they take out a £125 million loan to pay the wages last year because of a cash flow problem?

  46. oh liv4life, what i'm saying very clear. They don't really know what they're doing. (how could they, they admit they  knew nothing about football until they took over liverpool) and they'll fumble around for a while, making mistakes and setting their project back, before the eventually figure out what they are doing. 

    I was impressed when liverpool managed to get 17 players off the books in the summer, until I realised "Bold Live4life, he's counting academy players isn't he?" If that's the case then Hicks and gillette were much more focused on value for money because they got 26 players off the books the summer before last.

    Even then look at the 9 senior players they got off the wagebill. Liverpool legends El zhar and degen's contract expired. Liverpool are still paying £100,000 a week between cole and aquilani, with lille and milan paying the rest. Liverpool are still paying wages to poulsen, jovanovic, kyrgiakos and insua 

    So in short liverpool got nine fringe players partially off the wage bill, and then signed 8 other players on first team salaries. If you think liverpool's wage bill had gone down, I've got this bridge in brooklyn I could sell you. 

    You have to stop thinking about net spend, and stop thinking just in terms of transfer fees. That's not really how it works. Money you get for selling players only appears in this years accounts. Money you spend on signing players is spread over the length of  contracts. So you get profit today and losses over the next five years. 

    and put simply, signing carroll henderson and downing for a collective fee of nearly £75 million, and wages of £210,000 a week between them isn't cost effective. It's suicidal. 

  47.  Newcastle full every week are you sure?
    Newcastle last month were selling season tickets at HALF price to try and BOOST attendances from 46000 to try and fill the 52000 seater stadium.
    What have Newcastle achived with their policy nothing so far lets see where they are in a few years.
    Did n't Rafa wheeler deal in the transfer market and keep saying he needs more money?
    FSG are no muggs and to start quetioning them with newcastle? You should read the LFC news they are constantly starting new partnerships with companies like Turkish Tourism and Stanley Black and Decker in the last few days then there was park Inns of course lets not forget Standard Charter,Carlsberg and the Addidas deals and LFC fan base is 100 times that of newcastle.

  48. You need to go to the FSG web site !

  49. I agree with all you say matey, as for the Fowler comment, I could put Mcmanaman in another bracket, cos we musta lost out with him paying his bus fares an petty money all those years then he swans off to Real, lol. And I did wonder if a hundred was over exaggerating until I had a little trawl through a few archives, here's a few just from Benitez and Dalglish era's; keane, babel, riera, pennant, Garcia, morientes, cavalieri, Josemi, paletta, cisse, diouf, Leto, roque, antwi, Martin, finnan, le tallec, kewell, biscan, diao, vignal, m babbel, hyppia, cheyrou, zenden, hamann, poulsen, Konchesky, el zhar, degen, insua. That's 33 I think and that's only included very few players we bought from lower league clubs an then spent years nurturing then released. We also made no money on meireles which is heinous I think, an it looks the same with aqua too. I've probably missed a lot, and I bet if we put houlliers reign in there it would look ridiculous but half of them, mostly the end ones, went for free. Shocking really.

  50. Add these to the growing list!

    Man utd: Hargreaves, CarrickMan city: Bridge, 
    Newcastle: OwenChelsea:  Shaun wright phillips, ParkerLeeds: FerdinandAston Villa: BentArsenal: ChamberlainTottenham: Bentley
    These are just English players!

  51. anyone seen Mali341??

  52. For the love of god. I'm not saying that newcastle are the greatest team in the world. I'm not saying that mike ashley is a genius. I'm not saying that newcastle are the biggest club in the world. These are not valid counter arguments. 

    What I am saying is that there are a number of clubs who are renewing their teams by getting rid of older, highly paid players, and replacing them with younger players, who have been well scouted, and sign for low wages, and low fees. Newcastle are a very good example. In particular they bought four players over the last 12 months, in tiote, cabaye and Ba, who are all fantastic players, and cost tiny amounts compared to what liverpool have spent this year. 

    They have gotten rid of troublemakers, they have cut the cost of their squad, introduced a new £40,000 a week wagecap, they have radically improved their team, and now play very well as a team, both with and without the ball. But even if their season goes a bit off the rails because of their small squad, they will still have cut the gap between themselves and liverpool because they made a number of very smart decisions in the transfer market. And they still have the fortune they conned out of liverpool by selling andy carroll. 

    i'm not suggesting that liverpool should be more like newcastle. I'm saying that they should be looking at the smartest things that newcastle have done and learn from it. Because newcastle didn't come up with this. They basically copied the idea from man utd, who had copied it from somewhere else. 

    It's nice that liverpool are starting to increase their sponsorship. it is worth pointing out that all the figures they use for these contracts, are the headline figures, which will only be paid if the club reaches certain targets. so they need success to generate the commercial income that is going to enable them to pay for these hugely expensive, rather underwhelming players that they signed this summer. 

  53. I see Newcastle and Mike Ashley have upset the locals with their changing the name of St James Park to the Sports Direct Arena.

  54. Hopper- I'm sorry you're talking rubbish! Newcastle have copied Man Utd's business plan?.  NO THEY HAVEN'T.  They're using the Arsenal model.  They've made no secret of wanting to follow the Arsenal business model, since Dennis Wise was there.

    Mike Ashley wants to turn Newcastle into a feeder club.  Nothing more nothing less.  

    I can't believe we are discussing Newcastle's business model on here!

  55. Beckham,Woodgate Real Madrid
    Bent,Hutton,Keane Spurs
    Bent,Gordon Sunderland
    Crouch Stoke
    Duff,Sutton,Lampard,Parker Chelsea
    Smalling Man U
    Andy Johnson Fulham
    Shall we go on?

  56. yeah, sure. Ashley doesn't really care what they think. He saved the club from bankruptcy, paid off their debts, spent a fortune of his own money, and has paid to fix their financial model, and they all hate him. 

    If liverpool ever manage to build a new stadium, it's definitely not going to be called New anfield. That's for sure. I think it's up to supporters everywhere to completely ignore these new names and stick with the old one. 

  57. Think they've got the point now JJ.  lol

    You don't want to embarrass him any further, he's long gone!

  58. We will see if they sell Cabaye to man u in january!

  59. Tiote and Collocini next to be transferred out.  


    You also have done very little research or not grasped the current Liverpool model.  As I said before, the current liverpool model is by far the most advanced in english football.  

    Once you read up on the liverpool business model and have understood it, we can continue this discussion.  

    Also, the number of stars to come from united and liverpool since fergie joined is equal.  

    Let me help you a little with your research on the current LFC model, a good starting point; since Kenny rejoined we've promoted more youth to the first squad than we have in last 5 years.

  61. *when I say stars to come out from liverpool, I mean from the academy.