3/03/2013 09:25:00 am

No chance: Barnes explains why Suarez will not win 'Player of the Year'. Agree...?

Liverpool striker Luis Suarez put in another superb performance against Wigan last night, and with his second hat-trick of the season, the Uruguayan once again staked his claim for this season's player of the year award. From a footballing perspective, Suarez would be a worthy winner, but Reds legend John Barnes insists that he has no real chance of grabbing the award.

Speaking to ESPN after the game, Barnes - who twice won the award himself in 1988 and 1990 - argued:

"For his performances, yes [he deserves it] but I don’t think journalists will vote for him, and I don’t think the players will vote for him, and it'll be for reasons other from football"

Barnes is probably right here, and to he honest, it's not a surprise. Suarez doesn't appear to be well-liked by other footballers, or the press (!), and there are good reasons for that.

The Uruguayan has made a rod for his own back with his behaviour over the last two year, and I although he's player superbly well this season, it won't be enough to change ingrained attitudes.

Liverpool hero Kevin Keegan also believes it will be tough for Suarez. Describing the striker as a 'nightmare' for defenders, he noted:

"If he [Suarez] finishes off the season with performances like today, it’ll be very hard not to give it to him, despite the fact Van Persie and Bale have had outstanding seasons as well. It’ll be diffifult for him, but not Impossible"

Like Barnes, Ex-Reds boss Kenny Dalglish believes that personal feelings will get in the way of choosing the winner. He told The Mirror:

"It’s very hard to split them [Bale, Suarez and RVP] You can choose on the basis of their overall contribution to the game and all three have been exceptional. You can talk about making goals and about taking goals. All three have been exceptional. In the end, it’s probably just going to come down to which player you like most a person"

I think Suarez deserves the award, but Liverpool's inconsistency may ultimately put him out of the running. Man United are on course for the title, and they're still in Europe; Bale's goals have propelled Spurs into the top four. Liverpool are are seventh, and out of all cup competitions, so it's harder to see how Suarez's goals have moved the club forward this season.



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137 Comments :

Steve said...

I have read your articles for many months now, and I am yet to read a simple, praising piece on any player or any performance.
All you seem to do is trawl the Internet/tv for anyone who has something negative to say, re-print it and say you agree.
It is people like you who will ensure Suarez wont win player of the year. Remember, it's PLAYER of the year, not sports personality of the year. You don't like te guy - yes we all get that, EVERYONE knows that - its fine, get over it. However the vast majority of supporters all do like him (the ones I talk to anyway). Your negativity continues, no matter what - in all of your articles.
No doubt you will delete my post but I wanted to air my feelings.

andy01 said...

Van Persie will win the players award which is voted for early in the season, Bale will win the Football Writers award thanks to a hopelessly biased southern media who will vote for any London based player who is doing well.

Fuwee said...

Cautinho is Liverpool's Juan Mata n looks to get even better .
Ya ba da ba doo !!!

Simon Joseph Lau said...

To be fair to Raheem, Coutinho had already been making sub appearances for Inter 2 seasons ago and had a full year of top flight football on loan at RCD Espanyol. This is Raheem's breakthrough year in terms of getting regular playtime. It didn't go very well for the likes of Lucas, Hendo and Downing in their first seasons with us, nevermind playing regularly in a first team for the first time. It is no surprise Coutinho makes better decisions than Sterling.


But a front trio of Coutinho, Sturridge and Suarez, we're all looking forward to seeing it regularly!

Steve said...

..deleted in record time! Wow, what a fascist sight this is!

gilstrap said...

its a toss up between bale and Vp ..i personally would be surprised if surez is in the running he polarizes opinion to much

Bmccann said...

The most ingrained attitude against suarez i've seen is yours JK as you attack him at every opportunity. Maybe now u will change your tune but i can't see it. point being maybe the press and you should cut the guy some slack.

gilstrap said...

 lets be honest the groundsman at anfield makes better decisions than sterling...its hardley the stuff of einstein when a high profile sportstar decides to slap a girl in a packed nightclub ( Allegedly )

nick1811 said...

An award based on performance will have a winner defined by his popularity over suarez in the public. I hate people

DecDec89 said...

Seeing as Bale has also courted controversy this season with his own diving, I think it's safe to say the award will go to Manchester....

Brian said...

Can't see how Liverpools inconsistency may ultimately put him out of the running as it should only be based on his personal performance.I do agree with JB though,Suarez has no chance simply because he's not liked.So my wish would be he would continue in his current vein of form,finish the season as clear top scorer,loads of assists,and let the nay sayers live with their embarrassing decisions.Remember Ferguson said LFC should get rid,l think we can now see why.

Brian said...

lets be honest the groundsman at anfield (Allegedly) makes better decisions...

Greg | Liverpool Kopites said...

Spending time in a nightclub too when he should be taking care of his body and resting. Sterling is headed towards the same unprofessional path as so many early hyped up young British 'talents'.

Greg | Liverpool Kopites said...

Actually, for footballing reasons, it'd be better for Suarez not to win the award. It'd make even more footballers and fans of the sport think that cheating is alright.

footiefan said...

The last paragraph of this article is the most stupid I have ever read !!!!

You should facepalm yourself seriously ...

Sunni said...

I think suarez has no chance as well, unfortunately, as the whole country is against him even some lfc fans so how can he win it, at least everyone knows he deserves it, so that should be enough, even suarez realises that I think.

Bmcann said...

Where's my Comment JK? There is nothing in it that violates the comment policy except for taking you to task on your continual "ingrained attitude" to Suarez. If you give some you should take some. 

Chuckyred said...

He was 17 when it happened-what was he doing in a nightclub?

Brian said...

Is that foreign cheating or all cheating,lets be honest unless we start to categorise cheating (claiming throw ins,corners,fouling ,time wasting etc etc etc) they would have to scrap the award.Or maybe its just a Suarez thing?

Chuckyred said...

Can i just say, yes, Suarez has dived (although i only recall the Stoke one all season), and he has been guilty of cheating in the past. But if people are going to mention that as a reason he shouldnt win it, then Gareth '5 yellow cards for diving' Bale has, well, 5 yellow cards for diving!

JGirvan said...

VanPurstrings will win this easily, 1, He's a Manc, 2, we all know how the press just adore the Manc's 3, the press can hardly turn round and support suarez after tearing him to shreds (bit like you Jaimie lol) 4, the big supporting evidence for him will be he's been the difference and at the top end of the table that will make the difference. Van purstrings finishes chances whereas Bale and Suarez create more and finish chances, should be between Suarez and Bale really.

JGirvan said...

I think you're JK in Disguise 

Greg | Liverpool Kopites said...

Yes, Bale should not be given the award either.

brittanyred said...

The players around Van Persie were generally better than those around Suarez for the first part of the season. To me, it speaks volume about the Uruguayan.

gilstrap said...

 kissing goodbye to his career

gilstrap said...

fellani at everton has had as much of an impact as anyone this seaon...he should be in the running

trutherts said...

but thats not the way the people voting will see it the fact that he is british will cancel out the diving

gilstrap said...

if the criteria of the award is finding a player who doesnt cheat then you may as well look for the holy grail while your at it ......ill repeat this again all players at all clubs cheat and con the refs...wether this is right or wrong is irrelavant its happened from when  sport began and will continue till sport ends

gilstrap said...

 and bale and VP have never cheated...perhaps one of the criteria should be that to enter the award you cant have been booked .......ladies and gentlemen the player of the year award goes to.ethel the tea lady at charlton

gilstrap said...

no its a suarez thing hes the only one that cheats..all the other players in the prem are budding monks

billythecat said...

bale in line for oscar instead. planet of the apes 5 was a huge hit at the box office!!

gilstrap said...

that doesnt count as hes welsh

billythecat said...

then the merseymart vote could be crucial then !!!

Jaimie K said...

All players do not cheat. Many do, but not all. Plus, the difference here is that not all players *boast* about cheating in public, and show no remorse whatsoever, AND make a public vow to continue cheating if it helps the team. This is the difference with Suarez: he cheats, and he's proud of it to the extent he'll boast about it in public.

Jaimie K said...

Perhaps if Suarez didn't shamelessly gloat about being a chat in public he'd have more of a chance? Why should a self-confessed cheat win a player of the year award?

Jaimie K said...

Agree - No player who cheats regularly should win the Player of the Year award.

nick1811 said...

At least he was honest about it...Plus, It didn't stop you from saying he still deserves the award...

Jaimie K said...

Taking football ability in isolation, yes, he deserves it, but overall, taking everything into consideration, no.

And why should someone be lauded and praised for admitting to being a cheat? Why is that praiseworthy? If a mass-murderer admits he killed 10 people, should he be put on a pedestal too. 'Well, your honour, he killed 10 people but we should give him credit for admitting it'.

Brian said...

I don't think l know anyone who hadn't been a nightclub by the age of 17, but of course they're a different breed on here,i'll expect you back in a couple of years to say he didn't kiss goodbye to his career.Or maybe this is just another(groundsman) throw away comment.

OriginalChan said...

Persie has more league assists this season than Suarez and Bale...put together. I'd take Persie's link up play over those two, although Suarez has better creative on & off-the ball movement than Persie. Assists aside, there isn't much to separate them three in terms of creativity. Certainly do not comfortably create more than Persie does. 

JGirvan said...

As far as i know cheating occurs when you break the rules? Therefore every single footballer is a cheat as everyone has committed a foul of some sort or another. You can't split hairs, cheating is cheating everyone does it. To say otherwise is ludicrous and sanctimonious nonsense. 

OriginalChan said...

Riquelme was surrounded with much better players at Barcelona, yet he flopped and did far better at Villareal. Not such a clear cut argument, the one of 'oh he plays with less quality players, so he....'

JGirvan said...

Comparing murder to someone who breaks the rules of a game is a comparison that beggars belief. Not in the same ballpark and a weak attempt to try to justify a point. 

Brian said...

Anyone seen JC, maybe in hiding after 4 goals,an excellent performance all over the pitch and a Suarez hat-trick put BR on the front foot.

OriginalChan said...

Good shout. Has gotten some praise but still somewhat under the radar, compared to Bale, Suarez and Persie. But I think looking beyond the hype of those three, they have been better, imo.

nick1811 said...

Well I kind of agree with you, but I think the award should just be based on performance in isolation, but that's just me. I'm not saying Suarez should be idolised for being honest, but It's a lot better telling the truth, than when players like Ashley Young lie, and claim they don't dive. The way Suarez admitted he's a cheat was wrong, but like I said, he admitted it.

Brian said...

you loosin the plot?  awful statement,mass murder and cheating in football,absolutely should not appear in the same conversation!

nick1811 said...

Don't forget though...Bale has five yellow cards for diving. That means he's just as much of a cheat as Suarez is. 

Suarez has a longer history because:a) He has played longer, andb) Bale used to be a defender- Do you ever see defenders needing to dive, or getting caught in cheating spotlight? No, it's always attacking players. 

I know cases such as biting, hand of God, and racism don't help Suarez, but he should be judged on this season, not past seasons. This is the player of the year award, not player of the decade.

gilstrap said...

name one jaimie ..you name me one high profile player who doesnt or has never cheated...i cant think of one

gilstrap said...

 but where they liverpool players slapping women

Pigman said...

I don't think that he was gloating, I think he was being refreshingly honest.  Damned if you do and damned if you don't.

I believe that we've seen improvements in Suarez' overall conduct and I am in no doubt that he has been the Premiership's best player, but he'll never win the award, because enough people will never forgive him for past indiscretions.

This is one case where I hope and wish to be wrong, but let's hope that the hatred for Suarez, outside of LFC fans, encourages him to stay where he's loved, until he eventually becomes a coach for our future strikers after he hangs up his own boots.

Wishful thinking?  Not what you want, I know Jaimie!

gilstrap said...

 Jaimie can you not see hypocisy of that statement...a cheat is a cheat regardless  of the amount ...or to use your analogy a murderer is a murderer regardless of the amount ...whats the cut of point ..hes only dived once so its okay ...its a facile argument

gilstrap said...

agree some players are big fish in small pomds and vice versa

OriginalChan said...

For me, its individual form but when its tight, I take into consideration the team achievements, although that isn't clear cut. Persie been a big difference in the title race but they would still be in the hunt in the title race without him and considering how fallible City have been, United would still win it me thinks. We and Spurs would be severely handicapped, in terms of goals at lest without Suarez and Bale, especially earlier in the season with no Sturridge (still early days). Spurs have Defoe injured. I think if Spurs get a top 4 place, than Bale gets it for me. 

Pigman said...

Because, it means he's got more moral fibre than players like Bale, who won't admit it.

gilstrap said...

i think youll find jc is one of luis suarez most ardent supporters so he will be over the moon at the hatrick and win  

gilstrap said...

 agreed 100% ...to say anthing different is hypocrisy

gilstrap said...

so if you cheat and dont boast its okay.......jaimie thats nonsence and and deep down you know it is

Pigman said...

Yet, Fellaini's as dirty a player as you'll find!

ChrisConnor said...

Gary Lineker was never cautioned in his career..

Pigman said...

First, you say that not all players cheat (please provide a list, as I'm sure your audience will be delighted to point out a foul, or an attempt to gain yards on a throw in or free kick, or time wasting or some other broken rule) and then you downgrade the requirement to "No player who cheats regularly."

Suarez has cheated and I'm sure you'll trot all of the occasions out again, but this season, overall, I believe that he's cheated less than the average player.

gilstrap said...

 well he cheated on his wife....and getting all those fat twats to eat crisps is cheating the nhs out of millions

gilstrap said...

well hes cheated the nhs out of millions through making the obese eat crisps 

Tommy said...

well pleading guilty usually gets you a lesser sentence so erm.. yeah?

Kramer101 said...

Jamie you should watch this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jasUK3D9cYY&feature=youtube_gdata_player

There's so much diving and cheating going on to get to the point where Suarez becomes the fall guy for everyone else's cheating ( including referees and linesmen).
What will you ever talk about when Suarez leaves LFC?juan1001

Kramer101 said...

Jamie, is being called offside cheating? It's breaking the rules isn't it?

Kramer101 said...

No he doesn't. That's what makes him so special.

Greg Wilson said...

PERFORMANCE MOST IMMACULATELY PLAYERS AWARD SUAREZ NEED I SAY MORE ..... YNWA

Greg | Liverpool Kopites said...

Credit to him for admitting he's a cheat, but then he added that he'll continue cheating - straightaway undoing his 'good work'.

Al said...

dont forget Bail, he cheats as well as Suarez or even more...but wait! he's from UK...umm never mind, Bail really deserves to win the golden boot.

Daniel McMullin said...

Suarez will win the only objective award - golden boot.

Though he should get player of the year for his goals, play making, work ethic, adaptability, we probably won't.  It's a popularity contest, the Brit will be the favorite, because he is the top Brit, not top player.  If there's any true competition its between RVP and Suarez.  Voting closes April 2nd so maybe there's time for LS to change people's minds.

And the Footballer of the year award should got LS too.  He's been the bread and butter for sports journalists all season - not voting him would be like biting the hand that feeds them!

btw.  to clear there was no boasting about cheating on LS part, if you saw and understood the video (in spanish) it went something like "on that occasion against stoke, yes a dove, we were down and I was trying to get the win... ...but then you see the replay of things like this later, and I think "what on earth was I doing".  If anything he said he was embarrassed by what he did, rather than proud "boasting". It wasn't just an admission of the action, but he also showed remorse for the action. 


 

Brian said...

Allegedly

Trev said...

are you sure you dont follow manure   you always seem so anti liverpool

trev said...

thats a fact id hate to see manure signing him    hes absolutely on fire this season  

Real Kopite said...

at the end of the day, player of the year means player of the year. its the football people need to focus on and forget the past and move on. suarez has been astonishing this season and if u ask any defender who they hate to play most they will say suarez, no doubt about it, he doesnt just score goals like van persie or just ghost past them like bale does but he runs at them, puts them under pressure when they have the ball, nutmegs them for fun.

if someone scores 100 PL goals but then slaps a referee should he still not deserve the player of the year? at the end of the day every1 makes mistakes and if suarez doesnt get player of the year its just pure BS.

Real Kopite said...

exactly. player of the year is based on performances. but even so, a year ago, van persie was on absolute fire (just remember the last second goal against us, amazing) but i bet if he asked himself has he been better this season despite having better players around he will say no. he knows suarez has been the better goalscorer and player. 

plus if bale wins the player of the year then you know the award means nothing. he won a few years back because of 2 performances against inter and that already decreased the value of the award. if he gets it this year, unless he manages 15 goals from now to the end of the season, it is wrong. not saying this as a liverpool fan, suarez really deserves that player of the year. 

as well i also think suarez should be moved back to his original central striker role, downing should go to the left, sturridge cutting in from the right and shooting and coutinho should play the number 10 role behind suarez. suarez is too deadly to accomidate sturridge even though he has settled well there. but i think with sturridge more naturally being a striker this will benefit the team more as he will be looking for goals from the right. this will not affect suarez, whilst coutinho will be picking out suarez and putting sturridge through on the counter

Mark Whitelaw said...

Right, I've skipped down to the comments section before reading any others.

Jaimie, you, John Barnes, the press and whomever gets a vote on this will be wrong if Suarez doesn't pick this award up for 'non footballing reasons'

The award is for FOOTBALLER OF THE YEAR. Therefore, the FOOTBALLER who has consistently played the best FOOTBALL over the course of the season should be the winner.

I can't see him winning SPOTY, though, but FOOTBALLER of the year? Definitely!

Mark Whitelaw said...

That one's a bit below the belt but I have to agree with him not getting it as he's had, what, 5 yellow cards for diving?

Mark Whitelaw said...

Gerrard is a good player, so is Lucas, Sterling did ok,  Agger is good, Skrtel was, Carragher still is, Downing's improving every week, Henderson is starting to look the part, Allen started the season well, Reina is still a top class goalkeeper, Liverpool are the 9th richest club in the world and are 3rd in the list of all time trophy winners from the major leagues.

I don't see your whole "small pond" perspective!?!?!

OriginalChan said...

He went nuts in that Stoke game, did about 3 offences that could have led to 3 match ban per offence!

Martbadger said...

Ferguson would never permit Suarez to claim the award. He controls everything else so presumably he controls that too. Thank the Lord United won't have an English ref against Real Madrid. Here's hoping they get stuffed.

gilstrap said...

 i never mentioned liverpool ..the point im making is some players perform better at smaller clubs ie charlie adam..some players have to be the centre of attention to perform well  some dont

gilstrap said...

 but i dare say hes cheated...hes never scored goal when offside if he has and didnt own up hes a cheat

gilstrap said...

its cheating..if a player scores a goal when he knows hes offside its cheating plain and simple...if a player wastes time by feigning injury its cheating..if he takes a few more steps on a throw  or free kick its cheating there cant be lesser cheats thats why all this talk of cheating is poppycock

gilstrap said...

if you think about it there are others who have had an impact...michu...for one

Mark Whitelaw said...

I didn't get into nightclubs at 17 - I looked 12!

akula530 said...

""Its harder to see how Suarez's goals have moved the club forward this season."

I think this statement is patently inaccurate.  LFC has already surpassed last season's EPL goal tally of 47, and Suarez has accounted for 40% of those.  And that was accomplished while Suarez was the only fit striker and with minimal other goalscoring threats for at least 25% of the season.  While it is true that Suarez's goals haven't catapulted LFC up the table, think of where the team would be without them. 

Suarez won't get the award because people don't like him.  Fine.  But I hope that Bale doesn't get it either, because he no less a diver than Suarez but gets a pass because he's British, plays in London, and has the hairstyle and hand gestures to appeal to the teen pop crowd.

Jaimie K said...

None of that matters. The club has hovered around 8-10th place all season and is now out of all cups. If LFC don't finish above 8th this season then the club has not moved forward, irrespective of Suarez's goals.

akula530 said...

I think Suarez best shot at an award is the Golden Boot.  You can't argue with statistics and bias against a player by press, fans, etc cannot chalk off goals scored.

Suarez won't get any awards that require people to vote for him because there are too many out there who like having him as the league's villain, and who like seeing Liverpool off the pace.

But the more goals he puts in, the better his shot at an award, and the better LFC's chances of overhauling Everton and Arsenal.  I'd love to see him top 30 goals.

Jason Carr said...

lol

Jason Carr said...

suarez as no chance the bad press he gets will see to that most of it comes from this site lol ;-)

akula530 said...

Personally, when I consider whether a player is worthy of an award, I consider where his team would likely be without him.  For United, they would most likely be top even without RvP, and if not then surely 2nd.  Spurs would be considerably worse off without Bale, I'd guess probably 5th.  But without Suarez, and considering the dearth of scoring options the team had otherwise, I think LFC would surely be in the bottom half, probably in the 11-14 range if Suarez were not there.  So that tells me he has had the greatest impact on his club.  LFC's current place (7th) comes down to many factors, but I don't think any blame can be laid at Suarez's feet for not having done more to lift the club...

akula530 said...

As an aside, thanks to JK for creating a space for fans to discuss the team with a minimum of naysayers lurking to spoil good discussion.  I've enjoyed the site for months via an app on my phone, and decided it was time to dive in and participate. 

Looking forward to some good LFC banter here!

billythecat said...

??if bale got booked for pooing on the pitch would it be classed as going apeshit????

Ben said...

Does that rule out Bale for 5 diving/cheating yellow cards and Van Persie for that vicious elbow that went unpunished since this would also promote cheating in football.
I guess RVP will be forgiven because Ashley Williams nearly murdered him According to Sir Alex

Jaimie K said...

Yes, because I meant it as a literal comparison.

Ben said...

It is true |RVP has more assists than Suarez and Bale but it is worth considering United have scored 68 league goals to Liverpool's 53 and Tottenham's 49. Now when you consider Suarez was Liverpool's only fit senior striker for 4 months till Sturridge's arrival, who was he supposed to assist scoring from his centre forward role where he was isolated and is scoring 44% of his team's goals while topping the scoring chart not enough evidence he is punching above his team's weight.
Bale's record on the other hand is less impressive as he has had a free role or been on the wing where he is supposed to assist the strikers more considering Defoe was competing with Suarez on who was to get to 10 goals first earlier in the season as well as having Adebayor as another centre forward to assist.RVP's assist record is impressive but team dynamics play a role when you consider who plays around the striker as can be evidenced by Suarez' career assist record to date as well as the up turn in RVP's assist record since moving to United. Kuuyt is also another good example in having a brilliant assist record when he supplied the clinical Torres of old

Jaimie K said...

The only thing that 'ludicrous' and 'nonsense' here is the assertion that breaking the rules is always cheating.

Cheating is defined as:"Act dishonestly or unfairly in order to gain an advantage"Being offside is against the rules; is that cheating? No. What about players who accidentally break the rules, like genuinely mistimed tackles, foul throws, removing a shirt after scoring a goal etc. Cheating? No.There are lots of examples like this. True cheating involves premeditation and an element of dishonesty, i.e. diving, feigning injury, blatant shirt-pulling, deliberately taking someone's legs in a tackle etc.

Your definition is typical of the enablers, i.e. those who constantly justify - and often condone - cheating. Bravo.

Jaimie K said...

Your definition of cheating is ridiculously flawed. You argue that everyone cheats as a backhanded justification of Suarez's cheating. Typical enabling behaviour.

Jaimie K said...

If that happened, how do you know that Lineker knew he was offside? What if he genuinely believed he wasn't? 

Jaimie K said...

That's not what I said. Don't twist my words.

Jaimie K said...

No, your argument is 'facile', not mine. There's no hypocrisy at all. Like everything in life, you have to prioritise. The stuff Suarez/Bale do is level-one cheating, i.e. acts that are most likely to affect the outcome of a game. If someone dives in the box and gets penalty, that irreparably changes the game.

If someone pulls a shirt in the middle of the field, that has negligible impact. 

Jaimie K said...

Again, another enabler who tries to indirectly justify Suarez's cheating by trivialising it ('Well, everyone does it, so he's not that bad')

The proof of this is that you compare time-wasting and gaining a yard at a free kick with serious, game-changing acts of cheating. It's like comparing being punched in the arm with being shot in the head.

It's also like arguing that everyone who kills someone is a murderer, which is a similarly incorrect statement. As with cheating, the difference is intention, premeditation and state of mind.

Jaimie K said...

Jeez, are you seriously asking that question? With the greatest respect, it's so ludicrous that I can't be bothered to answer it (again(

You and others are so desperate to trivialise Suarez's cheating that you'll do anything to make it seem less serious.

Jaimie K said...

Again, that's like arguing there is only one form of homicide, and there are no lesser or greater types, which, to use your word, is poppycock.

Things are only this black and white for you re cheating because you're indirectly trying to defend Suarez. As I've said many times, you're an enabler.

It's not that black and white. Murder is more serious than manslaughter, which in turn is more serious than culpable homicide, which is then more serious than negligent homicide, which is more serious than justifiable homicide etc.

For all of the above, you wouldn't just go around saying 'it's all murder', as that would be grossly inaccurate. 

The same applies to cheating. Level 1 forms of cheating (diving, handballing on the line, feigning injury, deliberately trying to injure someone etc) are far more serious and damaging to the reputation of the game than stuff like stealing a few yards at a free kick.

Jaimie K said...

Glad you decided to take the plunge. Trolls are zapped pretty quickly here, so you shouldn't encounter many around. Thanks for visiting :-)

Simon said...

Nobody knows that they are offside, it's up to officials to judge it, they have the best view.

Cheating, in my mind, is an attempt to subvert the rules. Breaking the rules and hoping not to get caught..... Pires kicking opponents and falling over, Henry's handball v Ireland, grappling an attacker from a corner etc.

Blatant rule infringements, like last man receiving a red card for a foul, or a defender handling on the line are mere rule infringements. Nobody is trying to fool anyone. Nobody is deceiving anyone. It's unpleasant alright, but it's a professional sport where people will do anything to sustain their livelihood and most managers value players who will do almost anything to win.

Suarez has a nasty edge. But I think he is amazing and fear that we will lose him due to his brilliant form. We will regret not signing Sturridge last August.......

s.r.k.d24 said...

your argument is quite lame, because actually if people plead guilty they generally get a lesser sentence, so there must be something good in it that suarez owned up. suarez deserves the award because he's had to carry the team whereas van persie is in a team on top, and spurs also have better quality than us. bale is a bigger diver than suarez too.

Simon said...

Jaimie, do you differentiate between Suarez handball on the line to stop a goal and Henry's handball against Ireland?

Jaimie K said...

No. Both were clearly premeditated, dishonest acts of cheating.

Jaimie K said...

No, your response is lame. Getting a lesser sentence doesn't change the fact that what you did is 100% wrong. If a murderer confesses, he may get a lesser sentence, but that doesn't change the nature of the crime.

OriginalChan said...

There is more than one way to spin things, your spinning it one way and I'm spinning it another, as things aren't always so black and white. So even though I comfortably disagree with your post mostly, I can see where your coming from. Bale has only 1 assist in the league and secondly, he has had to service a absolutely woeful (in terms of form) Adebayor and Dempsey as well as the decent Defoe. You say team's dynamic plays a role, in relation to your point against RVP. Well the same excuse could be said about Suarez, who is allowed to shoot at will and take a lot of risks in and around outside the box, compared to his team mates. He has taken more than 50 more shots than RVP in the league. Suarez may not have a lot of quality to work with but certainly has been given the freedom of the park, in relation to how much he is allowed to roam and allowed to shoot. So I don't agree necessarily with your implied notion that Suarez is being made to play with a handicap on him. He has been as free as Bale, in terms of being allowed to attack at will and take shots. Both have more shots taken than RVP in the league. The man Suarez is allowed to rule the roost in the last third, whereas RVP has a shared workload, yet is still very productive for a man who is among many big fishes.'who was he supposed to assist'? Well since Sturridge has come in, Suarez's creativity and assists has hardly been any better. Sturridge has added something but Suarez has certainly not gone up a level, since his Sturridge's arrival. So no, I don't agree with this angle of 'oh he had no one to assist to', as its too black and white a view. There is no guarantee that Suarez would do better in a pond that has a lot more big fishes. Quite a few examples of players who fail to thrive around more better quality players and different/so-called better team dynamics. Yes, Suarez is doing great now in a mediocre team but that doesn't necessarily mean it means much more than a player in a better team, as football isn't that simple. The highest number of league assists Kuyt had in a season was 8. Not exactly 'brilliant', in my view, not even close. So I disagree with your use of Kuyt to back up your view, although I see what your trying to get in terms of principle, even though its not a convincing principle as it can be twisted all over the show. Hardly a massive improvement, RVP's rate of assists compared to last season and has taken more corners this season for United, than he did for Arsenal last season me thinks. So to conclude, I disagree with your take on things but its not unsurprising, as its a subjective matter to a certain extent.

Mike Aitcheson said...

I have a quote for you.


“I do exaggerate. Sometimes, for example, when you are in the middle of the action, you get a little push and your opponent has finished the attacking action.











































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“Then, you are in the right to show the referee you were pushed. That is not diving. That is saying ’come on, this is not honest play from the other players.’

“But, I had a little moment against Manchester United the other week after the whole Eduardo thing. I had the ball on the right side, cut it back and Evra gave me a little push. It put me off balance.
“I fell down and the whole stadium started to boo me but I was like 'come on, Evra pushed me!’“

Who said that? He's admitting cheating according to your definition, some might say he deserves to be branded a cheat .

It might surprise you to know, it's none other than our own current player of the year Robin Van Persie

Funny , you don't see this mentioned at all in the media, I don't remember him saying that he regrets saying it either.

I'm not condoning it from any player, but this POY list is going to be mighty short this year- We'' just give it toi the nicest player eh? Peter Crouch maybe? Oh no, he did that awful handball goal recently, and didn't tell the ref....

Mike Aitcheson said...

Van Persie said: “I do exaggerate. Sometimes, for example, when you are in the middle of the action, you get a little push and your opponent has finished the attacking action.










































<a href="http://trinitymirror.grapeshot.co.uk/national/redirect.cgi?target=http://ad.uk.doubleclick.net/jump/mirrorfootball.5293/news_mpu_article_300x250;gs_cat=national;sz=300x250;pos=article;sect=news;psect=home;templ=article;tile=8;oid=171145;ord=?" target="_blank">< img src="http://trinitymirror.grapeshot.co.uk/national/redirect.cgi?target=http://ad.uk.doubleclick.net/ad/mirrorfootball.5293/news_mpu_article_300x250;gs_cat=GS_CHANNELS;sz=300x250;pos=article;sect=news;psect=home;templ=article;tile=8;oid=171145;ord=?" width="300" height="250" border="0" alt="advertisement" />< /a>
“Then, you are in the right to show the referee you were pushed. That is not diving. That is saying ’come on, this is not honest play from the other players.’
“Sometimes you have a little movement with your arms or your body but I do not believe that is cheating. But it is difficult. It is not my intention to dive. I’m against divers because it is not honest.
“But, I had a little moment against Manchester United the other week after the whole Eduardo thing. I had the ball on the right side, cut it back and Evra gave me a little push. It put me off balance.
“I fell down and the whole stadium started to boo me but I was like 'come on, Evra pushed me!’“

Mike Aitcheson said...

 Van Persie has admitted to what he calls 'Exaggerating' a foul to get a decision.

Is he now excluded too?

lowey said...

between bale and suarez, got to be. suarez and bale would have another 10+ goals if they were in the manure team.
barca and real would snap up suarez or bale given the chance.
rvp class for sure.
but for entertainment and commitment in a just above average team has to be suarez.

Simon said...

I can distinguish between the two acts.

Suarez's was a blatant, red card offence and he was punished accordingly. He prevented a goal and was punished. And there was still a penalty to be survived.

Henry at most risked a yellow card by subverting the rules, by conning the referee.

I have typed this example out dozens of times on here.

Surely there is a distinction between the offences?

If you cannot see that then maybe you aren't as open minded as you think.......

Jaimie K said...

I don't see what the distinction is there. It all comes down to intention. The general definition of cheating is:

"Act dishonestly or unfairly in order to gain an advantage, esp. in a game"

* Suarez and Henry both acted dishonestly and unfairly: Henry deliberately used his hand to score; this was a premeditated act, and it's totally unfair. By trying to get away with it, he's being dishonest (in the context of football) because he's trying to fool the ref.

Ditto Suarez. What's the difference. Both are cheating IMO.

Alan Quinlan said...

By your logic none of the three should be considered for the award. All are guilty of cheating. I don't know any player in the epl that hasn't cheated in some form. If Suarez was English he would be nailed on. Enough said

Alan Quinlan said...

Idiotic to say the least.. Your not a Suarez fan simple as

Alan Quinlan said...

Arsehole

Alan Quinlan said...

Amen brother

Alan Quinlan said...

What exactly is it that Suarez did that was so bad.. That no other player has done. Then tell us why he is held to a higher standard than others. Your off your nut with all this Suarez hate. Best player in theeague this year by a distance and with very little supporting cast making his achievements even more impressive.

Manuel Rodriguez said...

your way of thinking is sooo flawed. Go see a shrink. Better yet watch the football kick up challenge video between Coates, Henderson, and Suarez to get a grasp on how a "game" of football is perceived by Suarez. Suarez is a like a child when he plays, does everything it takes to win, and that kind of attitude is what got him to the level and skill he has today. 

Don't get this confused with praising, I just have an open mind and understand where Suarez is coming from. 

Gary said...

As SAF says, its his temperant and character. Its who he is as a person, and he doesn't hide it. Comparing that to a murderer is philosophically wrong on so many levels that I don't even know where to start. 

Eric said...

Thank God Bale never dives eh, that should get him the award.....Thing is, Bale comes from midfield and still he manages to be top scorer for his team. That's why he should get it.

Simon said...

Suarez wasn't trying to fool the referee, it was an "honest" rule infringement.

He knew the penalty and accepted it.

He did "the time" for his crime.

Henry was exploiting a loophole in the rules where his offence, with the aim of the same net outcome, carried a much lesser penalty.

They are not the same offence.

It's too simplistic to categorise them as so.

RedWill said...

Ooooohh another chance to have ago at Suarez despite his scoring a hatrick. The can Suarez win player of the year has been discussed to death on this site and loads of other already. Just seems now like it is just being used as a stick to beat him with.

Insomniacnir said...

you mean figurative comparison, i guess. Else diving and mass murder can't be incorporated in the same breath

Jaimie K said...

Of course I mean figurative. I was being ironic with my last post. People know I mean it figuratively, but they make out I'm being literal so they can nitpick.

gilstrap said...

 jaimie i like Suarez a player but thats as far as it goes..i dont give a hoot if liverpool sell him or they dont ...all as im saying is your argument on cheating is subjective to one persons standpoint ...i think elbowing a player in the chops is worse than diving you may not its entirely subjective

gilstrap said...

 its what you implied though or im misunderstanding you statement...one of your main concerns over suarez appears to be that he gloats over cheating in the papers...i agree thats hardly stand out behaviour but by the same token it doesnt make him any more of a cheat than someone who comes out and apologises after every time he dives

gilstrap said...

honest Jaimie ill be glad when we sell suarez because im not defending him per say my argument can be aimed at any player....IMO dangerous play is far worse than handball or diving as you can end a players career

gilstrap said...

 nobody knows they are offside.....are you having me on

lowey said...

he plays deep striker bit like rooney

voiceofreason said...

Exactly

voiceofreason said...

http://www.liverpoolfc.com/news/have-you-seen/why-suarez-should-top-polls-1
He seems to come out on top based on stats. But he wont get it, the award will favour the British player.

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